Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

[Leo]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

I once designed a "propeller" for a friend. It was a twisted flat plate to be towed behind his sailboat, attached by a fine cable to a generator. I first tried using what I had learned about aerodynamics and found that tho both are fluids, there was little correlation in practice. Predicting it's shape and effects ended up being a WAG followed by experimentaion. Of course this was before home computers...

[First time Juke]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

......something like this ? Pontresina design by Luigi Colani !

Right:

http://www.rc-network.de/upload/1063349843.jpg

[Leo]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

A delta-winged MachBuster! Sweet!

[First time Juke]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

How about this; http://www.flug-revue.rotor.com/FRHe...05/FR7605d.htm

[First time Juke]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

Like said before the only way to get closer to mach one would be a pusher with state of the art aerodynamics and an ideal prop in it.

I am becoming very sceptical since:

Cirrus VK30
Bede-5B
VMaxProbe
LearFan 2100
Mach Buster

all these projects failed...

The main problem in all is the mid mounted engine cooling...+CG and stubby looks due to heavy engine ( mostly 4 strokes ) and prop weight.

If and only if these aerodynamical challenges and engine cooling is solved properly and convincingly without making the ac excessively heavy ( wingloading ) will a cool looking pusher ever become a winner and fullfill the potential that is buried in the concept.

Good luck for the next tryer.

Seems that only Jerry Holcomb and Molton Taylor ever fully mastered this along with few experienced Bede-5 builders.

[First time Juke]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

One more approach to this matter.

Since Dart had 2 seats I tried to incorporate also more passergers to keep fuse in nice form and get some useful outa this as well.

So here is a six seater for a TSIO-550A but a double V-8 of 1600 hp could be doable if 3 passengers were left out ( 1 if one V-8 was used of 600 hp ).

I wonder how heavy it would become but unlimited eligible at least.

[GeoffS]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

Of course, you can reduce the length of the drive-shaft and help with some of the CG by going to a canard configuration.

Cheers,

Geoff S.

[First time Juke]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

The downside of the canards is the landing speed and lenghty landing run....am I correct ?

[runnemrand]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

I have designed a single seat canard in x-plane with the sole purpose of breaking the sound barrier. It worked. The power plant is from the company which builds highly modified aircraft engines similar to the one used in Thunder Mustangs. X-plane is generally regarded as a very accurate flight simulation routine.

[First time Juke]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

The air intake scoop underside of the R3-A5...above ( two seater ).

Here is the update to that R3-A5. CG more forward..tricycle added and rudder stab added.

[GeoffS]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

The downside of the canards is the landing speed and lenghty landing run....am I correct ?

I assume you're referring to the fact that most canards don't have flaps on the main wing because of the nose-down pitching moment their deployment causes. It can be managed with engineering (ex. the Beech Starship has flaps). OTOH, if you're trying for flat-out high performance then the disadvantages of not having flaps might be worth it (ex. I believe the conventional-configuration Nemesis NXT doesn't have flaps).

Cheers,

Geoff S.

[First time Juke]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

Geoff you are possibly right. I am after low weight and flaps would increase the weight by several kilos.
Harry Holcombs Perigee had Guyana 35 hp engine that is 70 lbs. Starrair 280 ccm of same output is 13.5 lbs.
OTOH the flaps in Max III would make landing on a really small airfields possible. Some folks here who fly Cozys etc. are having trouble finding long enough airfields.

How does one make plane safe enough for lightning bolts ?

http://www.recreationalflying.com.au/forum/commercial-news/36355-missing-plane-lightning-bolts-risk-modern-jets.html

[First time Juke]

Peter Garrison in FLYING mag

Read the Pusher pusher- story in Flying mag. It goes right into the point in tractor vs. pusher plane debate !

[First time Juke]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

I also think a highly efficient form will give benefit;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaQB16ZaNI4

Those do almost 400 mph without an engine at all.

[Kahuna]

Re: Could soundbarrier be broken with a prop plane ?

I also think a highly efficient form will give benefit;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaQB16ZaNI4

Those do almost 400 mph without an engine at all.

.....have a closer look at the today's F1 class in Reno and youŽll find many similarities to today's composite RC Gliders !

Willy