Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

[RichH]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

Where is the *like* button!!!!!!?!?!????????

[FlyKidChris]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

If I had a nickle for every time someone said it couldn't be done.......
That and we will still be going 400MPH at Reno.
Lets see, a Merlin will never beat the bearcat, a Griffon will not work, mid '70's
We will never see a 450MPH lap, the 4360 will never survive Reno, early '80's
No new racers: Dago, Strega, Stilleto, Super Corsair, Dreadnaught 3350 powered Sea Fury's
The Bear is unbeatable, the Merlin is done the 90's
No one will break 490
The boiler cooling systems will not work, mid 90's
No one will break 500MPH
It is an interesting list of challenges and they were all beaten!
A Sea Fury pushin 490!
Strega and Dago both going 500+
A Yak pushing 490?
Folks this is the old US of A!
The Home of some great talents and the place that attracts talent like a magnet!
People still risk their lives to get here from all over the world.
Last, regarding the PRT's:
Matt Jackson managed to get that to work well! He also with Pete Law got the boiler cooling system to work on the mustang in the mid 90's
MN

Nice post and thanks for posting.

[Big_Jim]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

Nice post and thanks for posting.

I was having a conversation with BCIV on the way up to Robert Converse's memorial a couple weeks ago and we got to talking why Lyle never tried the PRT's on the Bear. The main problem had to do with the firewall and the wing root intakes not matching up with the 120 degree mounting of the turbines.....that, and the manifold pressure they were pulling would get that old turbine blade on top spinning so fast that when it failed it would come right back through the canopy.

[IcePaq]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

PRTs work best with steady state application.

Quick engine rpm changes are very hard on them for the same reason that the Rolls Royce quill shafts that drive the superchargers don't like super quick rpm changes..................the moving parts have a bit of mass with a fast moving turbine on one end and the gearing to the crank on the other with a significant amount of stuff in between.

[V1670]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

OH MAN!!! I just LOVE this forum! Sept. can't get here quick enough....

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

OH MAN!!! I just LOVE this forum! Sept. can't get here quick enough....

Check in mail... thanks!!!

[MIKE NIXON]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

Re the comment about quick engine power changes.
Start by turning off the video games and cartoons.
Next talk to someone who has actualy raced.
You never make sudden power changes when racing. You set the RPM and boost and hang on.
Sudden power changes causes havoc with temps, ADI flow and a few other things. Pull the boost off at high RPM and you risk turning the pistons into ash-trays. Go the other way and you can burn a hole in a piston.
Your comment on the quill shafts in the merlin being broken was more the prop comming out of the water and back in with the boats. I have never broken a quill shaft at Reno.
It is time to move on here.

[Exhaustgases]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

Its always a pleasure to see engine related topics here.

[Bernard Nieberg]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

I don't know the history on this but didn't Mr. Awesome run a 3350 with PRT's?
Does anyone know the story on that aircraft?

[tdecibel]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

I've been intrigued with Mr. Awesome for a couple of decades. Here she(He) is circa 2011: http://www.trade-a-plane.com/detail/...11/990244.html

Excluding the airplane's unfortunate history (bullets and whatever), could it have been a fast racer?....i.e, actually "compete for Sunday Gold at 480+ mph" fast?

[IcePaq]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

Re the comment about quick engine power changes.
Start by turning off the video games and cartoons.
Next talk to someone who has actualy raced.
You never make sudden power changes when racing. You set the RPM and boost and hang on.
Sudden power changes causes havoc with temps, ADI flow and a few other things. Pull the boost off at high RPM and you risk turning the pistons into ash-trays. Go the other way and you can burn a hole in a piston.
Your comment on the quill shafts in the merlin being broken was more the prop comming out of the water and back in with the boats. I have never broken a quill shaft at Reno.
It is time to move on here.

Please tell me your experience with PRT equipped engines that qualifies your comment.

I used to work on 3350s with prt at A.M.S.A. in miami on lockeed constellations and have replaced the parts I referenced and am able to see how the failures occurred.

Also.....I referenced "sudden rpm changes" and not the "sudden power changes" as you referenced.

They are not the same and your comment quoted above does not apply because of this.

I have respect for you guys but you can get a little pushy thinking that being top dog in one area automatically makes you top dog in areas other than your specialty.

Basic physics and experience supports my earlier post.

From past experience I will say "cue the fanboys to come running to support an incorrect conclusion just because of who made it".

[Exhaustgases]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

I thought the reason the Wright engineers used fluid couplings was to prevent shock to shafting and turbines, not only from rpm and power flucuations but from crankshaft torsional vibrations etc.

[Idaho_cowpony]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

If I had a nickle for every time someone said it couldn't be done.......
That and we will still be going 400MPH at Reno.
Lets see, a Merlin will never beat the bearcat, a Griffon will not work, mid '70's
We will never see a 450MPH lap, the 4360 will never survive Reno, early '80's
No new racers: Dago, Strega, Stilleto, Super Corsair, Dreadnaught 3350 powered Sea Fury's
The Bear is unbeatable, the Merlin is done the 90's
No one will break 490
The boiler cooling systems will not work, mid 90's
No one will break 500MPH
It is an interesting list of challenges and they were all beaten!
A Sea Fury pushin 490!
Strega and Dago both going 500+
A Yak pushing 490?
Folks this is the old US of A!
The Home of some great talents and the place that attracts talent like a magnet!
People still risk their lives to get here from all over the world.
Last, regarding the PRT's:
Matt Jackson managed to get that to work well! He also with Pete Law got the boiler cooling system to work on the mustang in the mid 90's
MN

I must say...we still haven't officially clocked clocked a 'real' (in my book) 500....



- JT

[Dialtapper]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

Please tell me your experience with PRT equipped engines that qualifies your comment.

I used to work on 3350s with prt at A.M.S.A. in miami on lockeed constellations and have replaced the parts I referenced and am able to see how the failures occurred.

Also.....I referenced "sudden rpm changes" and not the "sudden power changes" as you referenced.

They are not the same and your comment quoted above does not apply because of this.

I have respect for you guys but you can get a little pushy thinking that being top dog in one area automatically makes you top dog in areas other than your specialty.

Basic physics and experience supports my earlier post.

From past experience I will say "cue the fanboys to come running to support an incorrect conclusion just because of who made it".

There is a reason some builders engines are synonymous with grenades.

[Exhaustgases]

Re: Why no 3350's with P.R.T.'s.?

IcePaq (I used to work on 3350s with prt at A.M.S.A. in miami on lockeed constellations and have replaced the parts I referenced and am able to see how the failures occurred.)


Please tell us more. What were the failures and what do you think caused them?
Most all failures in engines fall into one of these, 1 lube film failure 2 metal fatique 3 over stressed. I guess over heating should be in there to.