Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

[Colbourne]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

The motor in the video I posted is only 750Kw about 1005 bhp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=tdt6auHq-Wg

When they have unlimited electrics running I would expect five times the power, possibly with multiple motors.

If you have a pack of eight of these aircraft flying towards you at 500mph, I think you would be impressed.

[Race5]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

Battery technology is still the limiting factor. That 750hp motor will only yield 30 minutes of range with a battery pack that weighs nearly a ton.

[Colbourne]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

Battery technology is still the limiting factor. That 750hp motor will only yield 30 minutes of range with a battery pack that weighs nearly a ton.

30 minutes. Thats about the correct length of time for a race. I dont see any problem making a plane which can carry a ton of batteries. The only concession is that I think the planes will have to start the race on the ground so that, they dont have to wait around before the race , reducing their available power.

I think you need a maximum battery weight rule to keep the costs down, and for safety a wing loading rule, otherwise try to keep the rules as open as possible to encourage interesting designs.

Over the years I expect improvements in batteries to allow more power each year, so there should be records broken every year.

For comparison the Tesla Model S car battery is described below :-

The 85 kWh battery pack weighs 1,200 lb (540 kg) and contains 7,104 lithium-ion battery cells in 16 modules wired in series (14 in the flat section and two stacked on the front).

The max takeoff weight of a Sea Fury is 14,650 lb (6,645 kg) with around 2,500 hp

[Race5]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

30 minutes. Thats about the correct length of time for a race. I dont see any problem making a plane which can carry a ton of batteries. The only concession is that I think the planes will have to start the race on the ground so that, they dont have to wait around before the race , reducing their available power.

I think you need a maximum battery weight rule to keep the costs down, and for safety a wing loading rule, otherwise try to keep the rules as open as possible to encourage interesting designs.

Over the years I expect improvements in batteries to allow more power each year, so there should be records broken every year.

For comparison the Tesla Model S car battery is described below :-

The 85 kWh battery pack weighs 1,200 lb (540 kg) and contains 7,104 lithium-ion battery cells in 16 modules wired in series (14 in the flat section and two stacked on the front).

The max takeoff weight of a Sea Fury is 14,650 lb (6,645 kg) with around 2,500 hp

That's not 30 minutes at 100% power though. Push it all out in race trim and you'd be lucky to get 10 minutes of run time.

[CubersWrist]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

We (Electric Falcon) are planning for a 5 minute race plus a safety buffer for cooldown and landing. Already got the motor turning and working through battery pack design.
This will be a conversion for Scott Holmes' #9 "Outlaw"

For those that facebook: https://www.facebook.com/electricfalcon/

[Colbourne]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

We (Electric Falcon) are planning for a 5 minute race plus a safety buffer for cooldown and landing. Already got the motor turning and working through battery pack design.
This will be a conversion for Scott Holmes' #9 "Outlaw"

What size battery do the rules allow ?
Is the power of the motor restricted ?

I will follow your progress with interest.

[CubersWrist]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

The rules are pretty wide open at this stage. This is good because you want as many different approaches, companies, and strategies as possible when starting something new like this. We currently have a max allowable continuous power of 150kW from the battery. So you do the math of 150kW for 5 laps (appx 5 minutes) that gives you the battery size and then you add in margin for safety and cool down and landing.

All electric motors are fair game. We can only have 1 prop or 2 coaxial props so no designs like the X-57 but that's subject to change in the future.

We are going to cram the plane full of batteries and we are either going to run out of real estate in the cowling or we are going to hit max gross weight, whichever we encounter first. Then the next challenge is keeping everything cool. Same challenge as all other air racing, just a different twist.

[Colbourne]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

The rules are pretty wide open at this stage. This is good because you want as many different approaches, companies, and strategies as possible when starting something new like this. We currently have a max allowable continuous power of 150kW from the battery. So you do the math of 150kW for 5 laps (appx 5 minutes) that gives you the battery size and then you add in margin for safety and cool down and landing.

All electric motors are fair game. We can only have 1 prop or 2 coaxial props so no designs like the X-57 but that's subject to change in the future.

We are going to cram the plane full of batteries and we are either going to run out of real estate in the cowling or we are going to hit max gross weight, whichever we encounter first. Then the next challenge is keeping everything cool. Same challenge as all other air racing, just a different twist.

Thanks that was very informative.
Will there be other races of more/less than 5 laps in the early stage ?

[Colbourne]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

https://www.engineering.com/AdvancedManufacturing/ArticleID/19454/Fully-Superconducting-Motor-Prepares-for-Testing.aspx?fbclid=IwAR03kskhyywj3olbO4pJHzGiYcg8CrdX0PiOAiS9q2jAkFQtadTLjLYY2-I

"The advanced superconducting motor experimental demonstrator (ASuMED), funded by the European Union, is developing a new fully superconducting motor with a power-to-weight ratio of 20kW/kg and an efficiency that’s better than 99 percent"

"The 1-megawatt motor is only to demonstrate that the superconducting technology works in principle, and we can scale it up if necessary to 10 megawatts or more"

[Triple-B]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

FYI - here's a recent article of particular interest.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...2.cms?from=mdr

"White Lightning" has contra-rotating propellers and can attain speeds of 300 mph.

There is a photo of Thom in Hot Stuff

-Bob

[CubersWrist]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

Oh my gosh this week has been special....

Electric Falcon/Outlaw is officially listed on the website now.

https://airracee.com/profiles/

Jeff went to Dubai with the intent of making headlines, raising interest, and hopefully connecting the announced teams with sponsors. So far so good on the first two, and he has Airbus on board so that partly satisfies the last one as well.

Lots of internet engineers talking about how stupid or impossible this is...I can't decide whether or not to laugh at them or roll my eyes. Don't get me wrong this isn't easy. I've seen the math for Race#9 and it's close on just about everything (weight, flight time, CG, safety, cooling). But the thing is this is no different than going air racing with a new IC engine.

We have a very knowledgeable, young (all under 35 I think), and eager team that is loving the design process. We don't have all the answers, but if we stay on schedule, we will in about a year.

Nice interview with Scott

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/electric-engine-air-race-formula-one-villeneuve-silicon-valley-1.5365770

https://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-news/edmonton-team-hopes-to-soar-in-first-electric-airplane-race?fbclid=IwAR1EsjBLfiSDpZEt7kau2l9A_oOCO_pFiwTsZ9rz989QGtVWo0eIUs0e0Ow

[CubersWrist]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

Big update this weekend.
Scott laser scanned Race #9 last weekend. We now have a full 3D model we can use to design and size battery compartments, motor mounts, cooling systems etc. This is very similar to what we did on Race #30

[Colbourne]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidebanis/2019/12/19/rolls-royce-unveils-pioneering-electric-plane-to-break-speed-record/?fbclid=IwAR2Lm0fek0oZdxbLGZwoqHR1JGEjWU0GyHUPJcIKTimEQkjVdYT90c6fEeQ#492105062e6f

https://www.rolls-royce.com/media/press-releases/2019/19-12-2019-rr-unveils-all-electric-plane-targeting-the-record-books.aspx

"British engineering company Rolls-Royce presented a single-engine electric aircraft on Thursday they hope will become the world’s fastest all-electric plane.

The white and blue one-seater, which was unveiled at a hangar in Gloucestershire, West England, will fly later this spring aiming at a record-breaking speed of over 300 miles per hour (the current record stands at 210 miles per hour). "

"The propeller is driven by three high power density axial electric motors and compared to a conventional plane, the propeller blades spin at a far lower RPM to deliver a more stable and far quieter ride. Combined they’ll continuously deliver more than 500 horsepower for the record run. Even during the record run the all-electric powertrain delivers power with 90% energy efficiency and of course zero emissions. (In comparison, a Formula 1 race car tops out at close to 50% energy efficiency)."

[gp70442]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

Interesting choice of airframes. Is this the single seater NXT that was supposed to get a Trace engine, then later a 12 cyl diesel, but was never completed?

Makes me think they chose this airframe so that
1) they have room for more engine in future and
2) a well tested airframe would greatly reduce overall development time.


GP

[GRNDP51]

Re: Isn't it about time Reno introduced an electric class

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davideb...Q#492105062e6f

https://www.rolls-royce.com/media/press-releases/2019/19-12-2019-rr-unveils-all-electric-plane-targeting-the-record-books.aspx

"British engineering company Rolls-Royce presented a single-engine electric aircraft on Thursday they hope will become the world’s fastest all-electric plane.

The white and blue one-seater, which was unveiled at a hangar in Gloucestershire, West England, will fly later this spring aiming at a record-breaking speed of over 300 miles per hour (the current record stands at 210 miles per hour). "

"The propeller is driven by three high power density axial electric motors and compared to a conventional plane, the propeller blades spin at a far lower RPM to deliver a more stable and far quieter ride. Combined they’ll continuously deliver more than 500 horsepower for the record run. Even during the record run the all-electric powertrain delivers power with 90% energy efficiency and of course zero emissions. (In comparison, a Formula 1 race car tops out at close to 50% energy efficiency)."

Good looking plane! Curious to see what prop they go with. Thx for the update.