Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window out?

[AAFO_WSagar]

I've done this..

From a V tail Bonanza...

Single door V tail, remove the piano wire hinge, window/escape hatch out. Some turbulence in cabin up to early in take off, completely calm with light breeze at speed.. It worked for my flight as well as the flight that wound up in the A&S Smithsonian story about the Hughes Replica.

You guys are about the best group I can think of to pose this question to.. Is this legal? I know with the Baron and big double door Bonanza's there is a kit that puts vortex generators.. or whatever they are, on the leading edge of the doorway.

Anyway, I've flown in a Bonanza with the pilot side rear escape hatch/window out... way less interior turbulence than say in a Piper Seneca with doors off.. Actually, only some really not bad air up to about takeoff speed, actually quite a bit less than that.. really only felt a lot of air in the cabin while taxiing, runup. Once flying, it really was amazing how much the air ignored the window!

Need to know! Have opportunity to have super air to air platform available at Reno... just need to know how we find out...

Legal??

Tia!

[tow-3]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

the type cert says that the 36 series may be operated with the cargo doors removed, but there is nothing about the emergency widow being removed. you might check with the bonanza society.

[GeoffS]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

I've always removed the cargo door. Same piano-hinge as the window.
The downside is you also have to remove at least one rear seat, but it's comfortable and the angle is very good.

Cheers,

Geoff S.

[SpinB]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

Just look out for this....



...jussayin''

[Wild Bill Kelso]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

As a Bonanza specialist I can answer this in on short sentence. No! A36 is legal without the cargo door with the proper paperwork. Egress window is not allowed.

[tow-3]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

bill,

just curious what paperwork is required other than an amended weight and balance. the type cert states that it is approved if the utility door is installed per beech dwg blah blah. were some of the doors not built to that dwg?

[Wild Bill Kelso]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

The FAA had to sign off the one and only A36 we did for photo ops, and a log book entry showing said approval. The question here is a V tail Bonanza approved for flying without the egress window. It is not.

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

The FAA had to sign off the one and only A36 we did for photo ops, and a log book entry showing said approval. The question here is a V tail Bonanza approved for flying without the egress window. It is not.

Sad that this is true, I've done it, (obviously illegally ) pilot had tested the configuration carefully prior to us doing it and reported the airplane handled quite well, although a bit slower than normal... This was in a 1955 or 57 airplane, unsure of model number, current "subject" is a 1965 S35...

Mike, do you figure that it's not approved, because nobody ever sought to get approval, or is it structural? Again, pilot reported no ill handling at all.

Thanks for the info, shoots the hell out of photo missions with the airplane

[Wild Bill Kelso]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

I may be able to find a approved 36. What days?

[Chessman]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

I would think your best bet would be to put in into experimental category for those flights.

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

I may be able to find a approved 36. What days?

I don't have anything set up with anyone, just playing with the idea, since my best bud down here at the beach (breakfast dood a couple years ago at Reno) just took possession of said airplane.. He's going to fly it down, I was just dreaming....

Back when we did the Hughes Replica flights, I wonder if Jim did do anything paperwork wise? The idea was hatched one day at his hangar when I was talking with him about doing some air to air.. He was game but I told him the only asset that I had was Parker's Seneca and it would cost me an arm and a leg for ferry time... First, he got right on the phone to call someone who had a door off airplane.. could not make it happen. Then he told me to give him a few days.... I get this call to be down in Cottage Grove the next day and they'd gotten the idea to just use Jim's nanza and pull the window.. They did a little "flight test program" found that it worked and used it for my flight and the one by the guy from Air and Space.. (one of my shots did get used as a promo for the article with his shots in the issue before)

Back by edit.. I forgot to add, Jim Wright actually paid ME for that air to air session! At first, he simply would not accept any money for the flight, mind you, both airplanes are his and his employee was flying one of them on company time, burning his gas.. Later, after a bad experience with the A&S photo guy, Jim insisted on paying me for absolute rights to several photos (meaning, I gave up copyright and photo credit for publications so he could feed them my photos, rather than deal with any more photographers) anyway, that was just the kind of guy he was. Could not resist to add to the message since I'd intended to mention it originally and forgot..

I would think your best bet would be to put in into experimental category for those flights.

Really wish I could contact Ron Englund who did the testing and the flights.. I kind of doubt that they would have done it as many times as they did (I think actually three times) if it didn't have some basis of legality..

Being just a lowly camera dog and not a pilot, I'm totally unclear on how to find out exactly how to legally do this... indeed, if it is possible... Would the experimental deal work??

Mike??

[tow-3]

Re: Off Topic: Q for the xprts.. is it legal to fly a Bonanza with the escape window

i doubt the feds would sign off on experimental. the only category that would work would be experimental R&D and that category would not allow a commercial operation that was not in support of the R&D ( since you would be taking pictures for sale)

lets hope that someone on this board has a a36 they can donate to you for a few hours.