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[boomtown]

Re: 232

Forgot to mention that being owned by Mr. Dwelle makes it kick ass no matter what................

True words. I make it a point to always fill up at their gas station Flyers in Grass Valley. They have a big Critical Mass banner along with other race memorabillia in there.

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: 232

Are stock sea furies or stock mustangs harder to fly? I hear the Mustang Is a nightmare to fly unless you become very good with it. I can say that I would probably prefer a Sea Fury for racing and probably a Mustang for general weekend usage. Not sure why though just seems right

I'm not a pilot but most of the people I know are either pilots, race pilots, or A&P's who are race mechanics... From what I've always been told, the stock Mustang is an absolute dream to fly... remember, it was designed for relatively low time pilots who were laying their asses on the line flying it..

I believe it's in an interview I did years ago, either with Tiger or Matt, or Kerch, where they talk about taking all the good flying characteristics out of the mustang to make it faster.. Stock, it's a combination of compromises to come to a good point during all aspects of flight. They way, say Strega is set up, is strictly to fly best when going really fast.. isn't necessarily the best set up for normal flight.

Don't know abut Sea Furys, other than Tom Dwelle once told me it was a fingertip airplane due to the way the ailerons operate at lower than full bank angle.

[GRNDP51]

Re: 232

I'm not a pilot but most of the people I know are either pilots, race pilots, or A&P's who are race mechanics... From what I've always been told, the stock Mustang is an absolute dream to fly... remember, it was designed for relatively low time pilots who were laying their asses on the line flying it..

I believe it's in an interview I did years ago, either with Tiger or Matt, or Kerch, where they talk about taking all the good flying characteristics out of the mustang to make it faster.. Stock, it's a combination of compromises to come to a good point during all aspects of flight. They way, say Strega is set up, is strictly to fly best when going really fast.. isn't necessarily the best set up for normal flight.

Don't know abut Sea Furys, other than Tom Dwelle once told me it was a fingertip airplane due to the way the ailerons operate at lower than full bank angle.

Interesting, maybe I shouldn't believe the news reports that come out. That guy that flipped the stang at Camarillo a couple years back had some news report about his death saying that to new stang pilots it's a real difficult plane to fly. I wouldn't think it would be either but hey guess I'm listening to unreliable sources too much. Hate doing that

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: 232

Interesting, maybe I shouldn't believe the news reports that come out. That guy that flipped the stang at Camarillo a couple years back had some news report about his death saying that to new stang pilots it's a real difficult plane to fly. I wouldn't think it would be either but hey guess I'm listening to unreliable sources too much. Hate doing that

For certain, I'm the wrong guy to talk to when it comes to this sort of thing and, frankly, I have to ask... why do you want to talk about it here where we try to celebrate the sport?

[440_Magnum]

Re: 232

Interesting, maybe I shouldn't believe the news reports that come out.

I wish some actual fliers would weigh in on this. Like Wayne, I'm not a pilot but I've read about the stock Mustang's flight characteristics for many years and talked to a few guys who have flown them, and its supposed to be reasonably docile compared to some others. From all I've heard, its most notable quirk is that at low speed the ailerons have less roll authority than the engine has torque- hence the placard you see in Mustang cockpits warning about the maximum power settings to be used on takeoff. Too much manifold pressure at a low airspeed, and the aircraft will roll away from the prop rotation. But to some degree ANY single will do that (except Precious Metal...) ;-)

[ChrisMX105]

Re: 232

At one time I heard that training should start in Bearcats, then P-51 then AT-6, From just having my ear to the grapevine I have the understanding that the WW2 trainers were rather unforgiving. Don't know if it was rushed designs or made that way to sort out who had the capability.

[wingman]

Re: 232

I'm not a pilot either, but been around these airplanes a lot over the years. Certainly the Sea Fury in general seems to be a straightforward and forgiving airplane. The Mustang has a reputation for being unforgiving in low speed and some high G situations. I've heard it said that the three most dangerous things one can do in a P-51 are first: get too slow, second: get too slow, and third: get too slow. Their reputation as doctor killers was bred by a myriad of takeoff and go-around accidents where, as described above, too much throttle is applied too quickly at too low an airspeed. A couple of Mustang pilots I've interviewed have spoken of having to be very careful of accelerated stalls because the airplane will depart very suddenly with little warning. They've said it's awfully easy to end up inverted and headed for the ground if you pull too hard in moderate speed steep turns.

Just my $.02 worth on the question.

Neal

[GRNDP51]

Re: 232

I'm not a pilot either, but been around these airplanes a lot over the years. Certainly the Sea Fury in general seems to be a straightforward and forgiving airplane. The Mustang has a reputation for being unforgiving in low speed and some high G situations. I've heard it said that the three most dangerous things one can do in a P-51 are first: get too slow, second: get too slow, and third: get too slow. Their reputation as doctor killers was bred by a myriad of takeoff and go-around accidents where, as described above, too much throttle is applied too quickly at too low an airspeed. A couple of Mustang pilots I've interviewed have spoken of having to be very careful of accelerated stalls because the airplane will depart very suddenly with little warning. They've said it's awfully easy to end up inverted and headed for the ground if you pull too hard in moderate speed steep turns.

Just my $.02 worth on the question.

Neal

That's what I was looking for, thanks,
Heard its hell at low speeds and applying power to recover that is not a good choice.

[toldjaso]

Re: 232

That's what I was looking for, thanks,
Heard its hell at low speeds and applying power to recover that is not a good choice.

Flying something with a 5 to 1 speed ratio like the Mustang has over something with a 2 to one like a Cessna would take a little more skill when doing a go-around...

[RichH]

Re: 232

Dave Cornell? Who is he??
Is he that guy in Canada that built a Defender or something?

I think I know:

[ChrisMX105]

Re: 232

I think I know:

Dave is way cooler and much less preppie than both of those guys

[Leo]

Re: 232

To drift it further OT, in my opinion (and limited variety of flight experience in mostly sailplanes) any aircraft can be a dream to fly, or a killer if it is not flown within it's limits, particularly the speed envelope. Most have some sort of quirk that will render it uncontrollable if you get too slow for the given maneuver, or too fast.
Perfect examples are the B-26 and the P-38, both had reputations for being killers until Doolittle and LeVier showed that all it took was discipline.
The Mustang has a reputation for torque rolling. I've seen a Sea Fury do the same thing by being pulled off too early and the throttle cobbed. It didn't roll but went into the weeds in a bad ground loop. All by torque and too low a speed to overcome it.
In sailplanes I spent a lot of time nibbling at the stall, and the ensuing spins. Gets you to really pay attention to airspeed.

[GRNDP51]

Re: 232

Any news...? Not for sale on any sites yet, or will it never be up for sale but just sold privately?

[Shawn Aro]

Re: 232

crictal Mass taken at Auburn Air fair september 27

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: 232

crictal Mass taken at Auburn Air fair september 27

Wow! It will be an amazing airplane! Many talented hands will touch this aircraft.

Thanks for being there and sharing the view Shawn!