Announcement

**CubersWrist** · 08-01-2018, 03:59 AM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

I'm going to be careful here.

I think there is....merit, to the viewpoint that RARA thinks the unlimiteds are more popular than they really are. I also do not think it is just RARA's "fault". The loudest shouts are from long-time fans demanding Strega, Voodoo, Bear, etc come back like it was in the "golden years". RARA is trying to cater to those fans by throwing money at the unlimiteds and begging them to come back. The museums have seized on this opportunity (as well they should it's a smart move for them), but I'm doubtful that will satisfy those asking for unlimited racers in the first place.

Sport is basically the new unlimited class in that people are actively modding their planes as much as possible just for the sake of winning (and we haven't capped out the displacement limit...yet). As for Sport class popularity. It's obviously great with pilots and teams. As for fans, well RARA can't simultaneously try to convince the public that unlimiteds are the coolest thing, while also trying to side-sell the sport class as the future (whenever that is). Prize money is also an issue in Sport, but it actually gets exacerbated(same in every other class) because so much prize money(percentage wise) goes to the unlimiteds and museum planes. It's kind of like an unlimited tax.

So I'm not against Unlimiteds. They got me into air racing. But if they want/"need" more prize money, then they need to get a sponsor

As for the drama for Race 77 and Race 2. I don't know anything I wasn't there, but hope they can get it worked out.

**Race5** · 08-01-2018, 07:27 AM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by GRNDP51 View Post

From Warbirds of Delaware (Pipsqueak and Viper)

http://www.warbirdsofdelaware.com/20...3/Default.aspx

There are very valid reasons that certain jets are not allowed back at Reno. That article addresses none of them.

**Bob** · 08-01-2018, 07:44 AM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by Race5 View Post

There are very valid reasons that certain jest are not allowed back at Reno. That article addresses none of them.

You are 100% correct.

**wajm** · 08-01-2018, 01:57 PM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

How about some enlightenment for those of us not in the know?

**chrs3590** · 08-01-2018, 10:07 PM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

I read the previous blog postings on the "Warbirds of Delaware" a few months ago and they certainly have a strong jaded bias that might be a little out of touch with reality ...

However on the particular issue of what disqualifies a jet from racing in the class, is anyone familiar with the current rules and restrictions?

I was surprised when I heard that Pete Zaccagnino was going to be able to race his modified L-29 this year and was curious what it actually was about that L-29 jet (and it's engine conversion) that qualified it for racing?

**CubersWrist** · 08-02-2018, 06:05 AM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by chrs3590 View Post

I read the previous blog postings on the "Warbirds of Delaware" a few months ago and they certainly have a strong jaded bias that might be a little out of touch with reality ...

However on the particular issue of what disqualifies a jet from racing in the class, is anyone familiar with the current rules and restrictions?

I was surprised when I heard that Pete Zaccagnino was going to be able to race his modified L-29 this year and was curious what it actually was about that L-29 jet (and it's engine conversion) that qualified it for racing?

Safety of the engineering/design behind the conversion is the issue. Not all designs are created equal so some will fail and some will pass.

**Race5** · 08-02-2018, 07:21 AM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by chrs3590 View Post

I read the previous blog postings on the "Warbirds of Delaware" a few months ago and they certainly have a strong jaded bias that might be a little out of touch with reality ...

However on the particular issue of what disqualifies a jet from racing in the class, is anyone familiar with the current rules and restrictions?

I was surprised when I heard that Pete Zaccagnino was going to be able to race his modified L-29 this year and was curious what it actually was about that L-29 jet (and it's engine conversion) that qualified it for racing?

I was surprised on that one too. The jet class tech inspector told me last year that they were not allowing any aircraft with a non-factory engine type to race any more. However that L-29 in particular has a lot better engineering behind it than the Viper installs did. I guess they were able to work something out.

**wajm** · 08-02-2018, 02:52 PM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by Race5 View Post

I was surprised on that one too. The jet class tech inspector told me last year that they were not allowing any aircraft with a non-factory engine type to race any more. However that L-29 in particular has a lot better engineering behind it than the Viper installs did. I guess they were able to work something out.

Well, let's hope the Sport and Unlimited Class inspectors don't take any cue's from the Jet inspector

**GRNDP51** · 08-02-2018, 02:56 PM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by Race5 View Post

I was surprised on that one too. The jet class tech inspector told me last year that they were not allowing any aircraft with a non-factory engine type to race any more. However that L-29 in particular has a lot better engineering behind it than the Viper installs did. I guess they were able to work something out.

What I heard happened was that Pete worked with RARA to allow the JT12 L-29 to race and they are supposedly allowing any jet with a non-production engine to race once again, they just have to abide by the speed limit. I'm pretty sure Pete did this so he was the only one who knew about it. Not sure how recent it was that the other guys spoke to RARA, but I think this change happened pretty recent. Or maybe RARA just doesn't want them there... Really don't know at this point, just a lot of he said she said

**Race5** · 08-02-2018, 05:14 PM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by GRNDP51 View Post

What I heard happened was that Pete worked with RARA to allow the JT12 L-29 to race and they are supposedly allowing any jet with a non-production engine to race once again, they just have to abide by the speed limit. I'm pretty sure Pete did this so he was the only one who knew about it. Not sure how recent it was that the other guys spoke to RARA, but I think this change happened pretty recent. Or maybe RARA just doesn't want them there... Really don't know at this point, just a lot of he said she said

I'm pretty sure certain ones are not welcome. Probably never will be.

**Race5** · 08-02-2018, 05:15 PM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by wajm View Post

Well, let's hope the Sport and Unlimited Class inspectors don't take any cue's from the Jet inspector

The jet inspector didn't make the rule, he just follows it. I doubt Sport and Unlimited have anything to worry about as far as that rule goes.

**Rigby** · 08-02-2018, 09:04 PM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by wajm View Post

How about some enlightenment for those of us not in the know?

wajm...ignore it. I have been a member for around 14 years, and every year, usually around time for the Reno Air Races, you get these "I know something you don't!" posts. Not sure what someone gains from such an announcement, but more power to them. It is sort of surprising that we are a little over a month away from the races and this is the first post of its kind that I have seen.

**Bob** · 08-03-2018, 05:21 AM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Originally posted by Rigby View Post

wajm...ignore it. I have been a member for around 14 years, and every year, usually around time for the Reno Air Races, you get these "I know something you don't!" posts. Not sure what someone gains from such an announcement, but more power to them. It is sort of surprising that we are a little over a month away from the races and this is the first post of its kind that I have seen.

having been a member for 14 years then you should remember the L-29 modded with a Viper motor modification that almost killed Heather Penney and the rule changes to prevent un-engineered modifications in that class that followed? Photos were everywhere. And I am sure you remember the Jimmy Leeward Galloping Ghost crash? That crash caused many more rules regarding mods that were not properly engineered and with properly documented testing. The NTSB report and rule changes were posted in many many places.

**Rigby** · 08-03-2018, 12:08 PM

Re: Some 'Heated' Jet Class Commentary

Bob:
Wish you would have read my post. I WAS ONLY commenting on the fact that some people feel the need to post, for the rest of us to see, that they know something we don't. That being said, they may be saying that to APPEAR important. I said NOTHING WHATSOEVER in regards to safety issues, modifications be they good or bad, or any other part of the original discussion. I also directed it at ONE poster, and that poster was not you.
And yes, I do remember the incidents you mentioned along with others you didn't. If you want, please take this dicussion to private messages so we don't continue a disagreement on a public forum.