Miss A ...what happened ?

[wadeh]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

...the racers are probably not going to be very enthusiastic about spending more on a system that is useful for one week out of the year.

If it changes a DQ to a podium finish, it seems worth it...

It would also help to eliminate any suspicion of favoritism in judging.

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

I love the transponder idea! The how do you pay for it question might well be to get whomever manufacturers that stuff to be a sponsor. Get them to be a part of the races, provide technicians to install their product and showcase it to the world.. Pretty neat deal for that company I think.. Who makes the stuff that NASCAR and the other ground pounder racers are using?

I'm going to add some stuff by edit: We m might well be at a point where major sponsorship of the event and racers could become reality. The how would be with Microsoft's new RENO simulation that's coming out soon. IF the interest in the sport increases via that medium, numbers attract sponsors, it's just business. I'm not exactly sure why Stihl does not take more advantage of their sponsorship of the races by doing what someone suggested "branding" at the bottom of all their ads, print and TV... Just a simple "Proud sponsor of the national championship air races" Reno and dates....

I USED to have a lot more energy when I started this website back in, really, the birth of the Internet days... My dream was to help bring enough attention to the sport to get the sponsorship needed to move it to the next level, or just keep it going.

How many guys would find the $$ and time to race airplanes if the purse was, say, a cool million?

Boggles the mind what stuff guys could come up with today the way tools have advanced over the decades...

We need guys like Bill Rogers willing to think out of the box and fabricate purpose built raceplanes! Given enough $$ incentive, and major sponsorhip at the top would filter down to the teams... we might well NOT be done with the golden era of Reno National Championship Air Racing!

[RAD2LTR]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

I love the transponder idea! The how do you pay for it question might well be to get whomever manufacturers that stuff to be a sponsor. Get them to be a part of the races, provide technicians to install their product and showcase it to the world.. Pretty neat deal for that company I think.. Who makes the stuff that NASCAR and the other ground pounder racers are using?

I'm going to add some stuff by edit: We m might well be at a point where major sponsorship of the event and racers could become reality. The how would be with Microsoft's new RENO simulation that's coming out soon. IF the interest in the sport increases via that medium, numbers attract sponsors, it's just business. I'm not exactly sure why Stihl does not take more advantage of their sponsorship of the races by doing what someone suggested "branding" at the bottom of all their ads, print and TV... Just a simple "Proud sponsor of the national championship air races" Reno and dates....

I USED to have a lot more energy when I started this website back in, really, the birth of the Internet days... My dream was to help bring enough attention to the sport to get the sponsorship needed to move it to the next level, or just keep it going.

How many guys would find the $$ and time to race airplanes if the purse was, say, a cool million?

Boggles the mind what stuff guys could come up with today the way tools have advanced over the decades...

We need guys like Bill Rogers willing to think out of the box and fabricate purpose built raceplanes! Given enough $$ incentive, and major sponsorhip at the top would filter down to the teams... we might well NOT be done with the golden era of Reno National Championship Air Racing!

I agree with the transponder idea. Get the company that makes them a sponsor. They provide the official timing and telemetry (of the location, speed, altitude on the race course.) Then there would be no question. All the data would be there. No chance of favoritism (Although, there might be some push back from teams who could be benefitting from the current setup. I'm not saying there is, but there could be.) I'd guess the transponder would be pretty small and could be clipped to the back of the seat or something so it wouldn't be that big of a deal to get one into even the IF1 planes, and would be easy to remove.

Yes, there could be some major $$$$$$$$$ coming in through Microsoft, but again, who knows.

I don't think the golden age is done, but there is lots of room for improvement both in how the races are run, and scored. With the transponder deal, it becomes a verifiable yes or no if someone is called for a pylon, deadline, or altitude infraction. If a pylon judge calls a cut, the cut can be verified by the transponder. Was the plane outside point X? Yes, so, no cut. If No, the cut stands and its not a point of view/human judgement call. Heck it would help even with qualifying. The transponder would be recording the whole time, pilot calls for the clock, even if the coms are having issues, the data for the lap is recorded and can be played back. It becomes "Sorry race 22 we didn't get your time due to an error, but we can look at the transponder and go with that. Do you want to make another attempt or just go with the data?"

In the end, I think crowd wants everyone to be honest racing. This is a way to do it.

Will

[Desertdawg]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

The Reno Air Races are just badass and judging how my 2nd and 3rd gen. (3rd gen. is in training) have become big fans of the sport, the Microsoft Reno Air Race simulator will get the message out and attract even more.

Now local governments (Reno, Sparks, Washoe County and the State of Nevada) and RARA need to be more progressive by thinking out of the box and the world will come to Reno annually!

Plus like I have mentioned several times here, the unlimited title for the warbirds needs to go away. Museum, Sport Modified and Super Stock classes. Then of course should some highly modified ones come back then there can be a unlimited class. What is racing today is far from unlimited of yesterday. The gold race yesterday between Miss A and Dread was very exciting.

[GRNDP51]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

The Reno Air Races are just badass and judging how my 2nd and 3rd gen. (3rd gen. is in training) have become big fans of the sport, the Microsoft Reno Air Race simulator will get the message out and attract even more.

Now local governments (Reno, Sparks, Washoe County and the State of Nevada) and RARA need to be more progressive by thinking out of the box and the world will come to Reno annually!

Plus like I have mentioned several times here, the unlimited title for the warbirds needs to go away. Museum, Sport Modified and Super Stock classes. Then of course should some highly modified ones come back then there can be a unlimited class. What is racing today is far from unlimited of yesterday. The gold race yesterday between Miss A and Dread was very exciting.

As has been the topic of discussion the past decade, how do we get the younger generations interested? Hopefully flight sim will do just that. I know of a handful of really popular youtubers that can get a quarter million views plus on a flight sim video. That?s huge exposure to the demographics that watch youtubers and streamers. Who knows, if Microsoft knocks it out of the park with the competitive aspect, maybe it?s something we could see becoming a major e-sport. There?s going to have to be a real ?skill gap? between people who are willing to put in the effort to get better at the simulator. If anyone can hop on and win then this isn?t going to go far. That?s what have made first/third person shooters so successful, you have to work to get good and that is addicting.

I do like that the T6 class perfectly separated the class into Gold and Classic. There were 7 fast planes and 5 slow planes and they set the fields just like that (rather than an even 6 and 6 where a fast plane would be in the Classic race). This could definitely apply to the Unlimiteds.

[Desertdawg]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

My son got the new xbox and Microsoft simulator game. Its pretty awesome, the last video games I played and enjoyed was 40 years ago, pacman and that atari game LOL
Now that I am retired I will get into this Reno Air Race flying simulator game in a big way if it turns out like what I experienced flying on my son's new sim setup. Motion seats are getting down there, and surround sound and seat rumbler, 3 monitors, I would be in on cloud once I got good flying Red Baron around the course, then jump into my corsair or P38. Here comes the Dawg down the VoS LOL
On the bright side that's probably one thing the kids will enjoy inheriting once I go under :-)

As has been the topic of discussion the past decade, how do we get the younger generations interested? Hopefully flight sim will do just that. I know of a handful of really popular youtubers that can get a quarter million views plus on a flight sim video. That?s huge exposure to the demographics that watch youtubers and streamers. Who knows, if Microsoft knocks it out of the park with the competitive aspect, maybe it?s something we could see becoming a major e-sport. There?s going to have to be a real ?skill gap? between people who are willing to put in the effort to get better at the simulator. If anyone can hop on and win then this isn?t going to go far. That?s what have made first/third person shooters so successful, you have to work to get good and that is addicting.

I do like that the T6 class perfectly separated the class into Gold and Classic. There were 7 fast planes and 5 slow planes and they set the fields just like that (rather than an even 6 and 6 where a fast plane would be in the Classic race). This could definitely apply to the Unlimiteds.

[Desertdawg]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

Getting back on the subject. I wonder if Brent ever thought about putting someone like Steve Jr in the seat?

Then he could sit back and watch his baby Miss A fly around the pylons?

[Guest]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

I don't wish to be the turd in the punchbowl but I'm not a fan of using transponders, ADS-B etc. in judging the event. Never have been. It's sport built by humans, run by humans, performed by humans, and judged by humans.

No more so than I'm a fan of using instant replay. Same reason....(dog licks his balls syndrome...just because he can doesn't mean he should). I spent over a decade as an NCAA basketball official. Did I get every call right. No. But then, the stud point guard did hit every shot he took, did he? Same thing for NFL, MLB, etc. MLB guys get paid millions to bat less than 35%. That's a failure rate of 65%. Wide receivers drop passess...QB's throw interceptions, etc.

Look I get that these may not be the best analogies on the planet but...what's next?

BTW, the issue with Miss America was both High Flying and a South Showline Cut. Both of which are DQ events. And the Contest Committee does not make those decisions lightly, believe me. Passing other aircraft and safety of flight are ALWAYS considered and take priority before a DQ is issued.

OK...soap box is back under the desk....

[CubersWrist]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

The show line cut was pretty easy to predict. #11 went way wide around 8-9-10 each lap and then would spend the next lap regaining ground only to lose it again after the VoS. The last lap with lapped traffic made me nervous sitting on the bleachers in the pit area.

For flying too high I hope this might be good ammo to reevaluate (not necessarily remove) the height limit. The height limit was a knee jerk reaction after 2011 and would not have made 2011 any better. Therefore it's effectiveness in promoting safety should be questioned.

Papa 51 installed telemetry into the IF1s for one of the international races (Thailand or Chain don't remember which). So whether you are for it or against, the technology does exist.

I'd like 360 cameras on top of each pylon for 2 reasons. 1) for pylon cut reviews and 2) the footage would be awesome.

As for the timing, this seems to have happened enough times that it might be smart for teams (I'm talking to myself now) send someone to the bleachers to record video and time the laps. Just to cover their own butts and serve as a backup in case RARA has a mistake or technical difficulty.

[supercub]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

2022 Air Races will be exciting. It will soon be announced that a company will sponsor the unlimited class next year with a One Million Dollar purse. The following aircraft are expected to participate:
1. Strega
2. Voodoo
3. Dago Red
4. Chec Mate
5. Tsunami
6. Shockwave
7. Rare Bear
8. Miss America
and several other aircraft.
Hey............one can dream.

Why is there a maximum altitude restriction? Deadlines I can understand. Can someone explain the Max Alt limitation?
Thanks

[Tibia]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

...
Why is there a maximum altitude restriction? Deadlines I can understand. Can someone explain the Max Alt limitation?
Thanks

The greater the height, the great the spread of projectiles. Calculations based on that spread resolved into a max height restriction.

[Desertdawg]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

deleted

[88SC]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

Playing with a plausible hypothetical, if Hisey had started a race in the second spot, could he have out accelerated Dread going down the chute? Then it would have been Swager?s job to pass for the lead.

I wondered elsewhere how fast a lap Dreadnought can turn with the limitation of the short tail. In ?83, their first year out, Neil Anderson qualified at 446, albeit on a different course. Essentially, that makes the task a minimum of being able to make eight 446 laps (or whatever the equivalent is on the current course) and hold together. Or am I looking at it wrong?

[GRNDP51]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

Playing with a plausible hypothetical, if Hisey had started a race in the second spot, could he have out accelerated Dread going down the chute? Then it would have been Swager?s job to pass for the lead.

I wondered elsewhere how fast a lap Dreadnought can turn with the limitation of the short tail. In ?83, their first year out, Neil Anderson qualified at 446, albeit on a different course. Essentially, that makes the task a minimum of being able to make eight 446 laps (or whatever the equivalent is on the current course) and hold together. Or am I looking at it wrong?

Yes, Hisey very likely could've passed Dreadnought from the second spot. He kept with Dreadnought the whole race having the outside line and being pushed up and down while they lapped traffic. I still think Miss A is the faster plane.

The 426 average on today's timing is about 435 on the old timing. Factor in the course changes and short tail, I think we saw really close to what Dreadnought can run currently. I still didn't get a confirmation from anyone, but I heard Danny say 441 on lap 5 or 6. If that was true, Dread was likely at the limit.

[L.E.D.]

Re: Miss A ...what happened ?

It was a definite bummer to walk up from the pits to the ramp for the trophy ceremony to find Miss A nowhere in sight.

I can recall when Dreadnought (2007) and Precious Metal (2014) were each DQ'd in the final. Stuff happens, I guess.

But it was sure nice to see Miss A out there going fast, and I hope to see her out there again.