A Wingman quiz

[kennsmithf2g]

Re: A Wingman quiz

Isn't there -2- air frames that have carried the "Big Red" name? I thought I read that somewhere.

[wingman]

Re: A Wingman quiz

I don't know, Kenn. This one did not get the name until about 1980. Jerry McDonald bought it in 1978 or so. Mojave 1978 was his first race, and it was #51 with no name yet (and painted solid red). Actually Jerry just added the 1 temporarily -- there was another Race 5 at that point. By 1981 Jerry had repainted the airplane as Big Red and it has kept basically the same paint scheme under its present owner to this day.

Neal

[RAD2LTR]

Re: A Wingman quiz

Hahah well I was half right. I was trying to figure out the other two planes.

That was a cool formation.

Will

[Shawn Aro]

Re: A Wingman quiz

I don't know, Kenn. This one did not get the name until about 1980. Jerry McDonald bought it in 1978 or so. Mojave 1978 was his first race, and it was #51 with no name yet (and painted solid red). Actually Jerry just added the 1 temporarily -- there was another Race 5 at that point. By 1981 Jerry had repainted the airplane as Big Red and it has kept basically the same paint scheme under its present owner to this day.

Neal

I remember that picture it was in the Mojave program 1979

i was only 11 couldn't too young to know this

Shawn

[wingman]

Re: A Wingman quiz

I wouldn't worry, Shawn -- nobody else knew it either.

Neal

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: A Wingman quiz

I guessed it but didn't post my guess (figured I was wrong lol) Almost had to be that since you id'd them as t-6 and snj... which eliminated just about every other reason... good quiz!

[Big_Jim]

Re: A Wingman quiz

-- nobody else knew it either.

I did. I just haven't been around all day today. :-) I always liked that Mac's 1972 winner is still alive and kicking!

[wadeh]

Re: A Wingman quiz

I find it interesting that there seems to be no interest in this quiz -- how're people going to have a functioning Air Racing website if nobody gives a sh*t?

It's not that I have no interest in this quiz. It's just that, not only did I not know the answer, I didn't have any idea.

I love seeing the quizzes, but the reality is that I've only been going to the air races for just under 25 years, and most of that time I just sat in the stands. When I found this site online, I started to dig deeper, and that's been great (I would hate to see this site go away).

But most of these quizzes make me feel like a complete newb.

Beyond that, the expertise of some of the folks here is so deep that it's a bit intimidating to toss stuff out there. That's a bit of a double-edged sword. It makes the site an incredible resource, but it does mean that I read a whole lot more than I write.

[wingman]

Re: A Wingman quiz

Do you learn from the quizzes? I can understand some intimidation -- people like Big Jim are scary. Mostly I'd say don't worry about it. If you have questions ask -- if you don't understand something ask. If you took a neat picture 15 years ago with something in it that you've always wondered about -- post the picture and ask...

This place can be fun, interesting, and educational. You'll never really understand how Air Racing is now if you don't have some understanding of what went before. You can be a consumer or an actor. I've always hated to just be a consumer -- you might as well be on Faceplant. I'd much rather know how things work, and how we got to where we are. That can be the value of a place like AAFO.

Neal

[wadeh]

Re: A Wingman quiz

Do you learn from the quizzes? I can understand some intimidation -- people like Big Jim are scary.

Yes, I find the quizzes to be both entertaining and educational. I read all of them (I read all the posts to this forum).

As for scary people, that doesn't bother me. I've been on the internet for a very long time. I'm a retired software engineer who spent 25 years developing low level internet software. At one point, about 35% of the total servers on the internet were executing at least some code that I wrote. It's less now, but still in the millions of machines. And in my office, I had a bit of a reputation as the scary one. So no problem with that.

It's more of a matter that I often times don't even feel like I know enough to ask an intelligent question (which is my hangup; I'm used to being a subject matter expert).

Since you suggested asking away, here are a few things that I'm curious about:

Why did they design the P63 as a mid-engined airplane? A friend (who's a retired A&P for a major carrier) and I were talking about it. We could think of lots of reasons why a mid-engine design had lots of drawbacks, but had trouble listing advantages. And what's up with the car style doors? Would that not make it problematic to bail out if you needed to? I had a friend when I was much younger who had a relative who was killed in an accident where they were doing aerobatics in a high wing airplane (for which the plane was certified). The wing spar failed with the aircraft inverted and the wings folded against the doors, trapping them inside. So I am conscious of this kind of thing. This seems like a pretty undesirable design for a fighter.

I also have some questions around how race numbers are chosen.

I've noticed that Red Baron and Big Red are both conspicuously red (even with "Red" in their names). Is it a coincidence that both of them are Race 5? Similarly, Miss Ashley Too was a Griffon powered Mustang with contra-rotating props, using Race 38. A year or two after it was lost, I saw Precious Metal for the first time. Is it a coincidence that it was a Griffon powered Mustang with contra-rotating props, and was also Race 38?

[wingman]

Re: A Wingman quiz

Actually some interesting questions. The contra rotating Race 38s are complicated. Gary Levitz's P-38 was number 38 for years, and even with the P-38 out of the picture he had kept the number. His red Mustang was #38, and eventually so was Miss Ashley II. Along the way he put the number on the Mustang below even though he never got to race it. When Gary died the number became available again. I hope Speedy will come in to correct my account and continue it...

A racing number is owned by the pilot or owner as long as they pay for it each year.

Neal

[RAD2LTR]

Re: A Wingman quiz

What happened to Thunderbird? Is it still Thunderbird and never gets flown or did it become some other fake persona like most of the other cool racers with unique personalities? (Yes trading histories from a plane with no combat history for a combat history it never had bugs me. Especially when the colorful real history of said racer is lost.)

Will

[T. Adams]

Re: A Wingman quiz

What happened to Thunderbird? Is it still Thunderbird and never gets flown or did it become some other fake persona like most of the other cool racers with unique personalities? (Yes trading histories from a plane with no combat history for a combat history it never had bugs me. Especially when the colorful real history of said racer is lost.)

Will

https://www.mustangsmustangs.net/p-51/survivors/serial/44-73704

[CJAM427]

Re: A Wingman quiz

Actually some interesting questions. The contra rotating Race 38s are complicated. Gary Levitz's P-38 was number 38 for years, and even with the P-38 out of the picture he had kept the number. His red Mustang was #38, and eventually so was Miss Ashley II. Along the way he put the number on the Mustang below even though he never got to race it. When Gary died the number became available again. I hope Speedy will come in to correct my account and continue it...

A racing number is owned by the pilot or owner as long as they pay for it each year.

Neal

That is a great lineup there. Is that for the Boulder City/Las Vegas race in '89?

Brad is the expert on that particular Mustang, but I think I remember that it was more or less "on loan" to Gary at that time as the Whittingtons were in a bit of trouble. Gary previously owned it before the Whittington's did in 1975 and it wore #81, which I think was a tribute to Leroy Penhall.

[Lon Moer]

Re: A Wingman quiz

What happened to Thunderbird? Is it still Thunderbird and never gets flown or did it become some other fake persona like most of the other cool racers with unique personalities? (Yes trading histories from a plane with no combat history for a combat history it never had bugs me. Especially when the colorful real history of said racer is lost.)

Will

https://www.mustangsmustangs.net/p-5...erial/44-73704

The first owner after being restored as a warbird kept a Thunderbird emblem on it as a tribute.
Later owners did not retain the Thunderbird.