MA-III?

[Peashooter]

Before flying home today (I'm in Dallas as I write this), my bro and I went to the Planes of Fame. We looked at everything, including the EXTENSIVE, excellent model collection. Among the air racing models was this, a rendering of Miss Ashley-III. As the card notes, it was never built. It appears to be a MK-XIV Spit with a taller tail. Love the M&M graphics.

Anybody know any more about this? Peas.

PS Yes, we were at Chino one week too early! Such is fate.

[FlyKidChris]

Re: MA-III?

If I remember correctly, this was Bill Rodgers original concept, the one that became MA II. While in the planning process, he considered Jet Commander wings (I think) until he discussed it with John Dilley, who (of course) suggested the "LearStang" concept that was Vendetta.
Then again, I could be wrong, but that's what I recall.

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: MA-III?

If I remember correctly, this was Bill Rodgers original concept, the one that became MA II. While in the planning process, he considered Jet Commander wings (I think) until he discussed it with John Dilley, who (of course) suggested the "LearStang" concept that was Vendetta.
Then again, I could be wrong, but that's what I recall.

Chris,

you're correct on Bill's first plan.. this is from an interview I did with him back in '97 - '98

"I drew up a bunch of drawings using a Jet Commander wing. I was going to cut 8 1/2 feet out of the center of the wing then make a bunch of basically "bathtub" fittings so that I could bolt the two outboard wings together. That would give you 209 sq feet, about the same as a Mustang, then mate it to a scratch built Mustang fuselage. I started talking to John Dilley at Reno, this was after he'd accidented "Vendetta", he told me "no use this [Lear] wing...it's a better wing". It took him about six months to convince me to use that wing, but the more I got to looking at it, and the more I got to playing with the numbers, I decided it probably was a better wing"

( rest of the interview )

Not sure if that's a model of the original concept though. Bill himself made a model somewhere back there.. wonder if it could be this one?

Wayne

[Randy Haskin]

Re: MA-III?

I used to work at Flightcraft Inc, an FBO at Boeing Field up in Seattle, when I was going to the Univ of Washington.

Rogers rented an office in the Flightcraft building up on the second floor. I had no idea who Bill Rogers was at the time, to be honest, much less that he had an office in the building I worked in.

Never the less, one day in late 1993 I was vacuuming the floors (standard line service job, right??) up there and I happened to look through the window of his office and see a large 3-view blueprint of a Mustang pinned to the wall. On closer inspection, the 3-view showed a learjet-winged Mustang and the moniker "Vendetta II" in the bottom right corner of the drawing.

So, I don't know much about the details here, but at least circa '93 he was considering the same concept that developed into MA-2.

[FlyKidChris]

Re: MA-III?

I can't put my "finger on it," but I recall a drawing of a Bill Rodgers concept that was much like the model in the photo. It first struck me as a Griffon powered Spitfire with an H model Mustang tail. Maybe it was in EAA's magazine, "Sport Aviation" but I'm far from certain about that.

[W J Pearce]

Re: MA-III?

Chris, there is a drawing that sound like the one you speak of in Griffon Powered Mustangs by A Kevin Gantham and Nicholas Veronico. The caption states that the original concept was a Mk.XIV Spitfire with a cut down canopy and a P-51H tail. It kind of looks like the model but with a contra-prop.

The book also has a picture of a model named Vendetta II, but it does not resemble the model in this post. It looks like a P-51 D fuselage and tail with a Precious Metal style canopy and turtledeck, Learjet horz stab, wings that are swept back but the trailing edge has no sweep. 4-blade prop and no M&M's.

Bill Pearce

[speeddemon]

Re: MA-III?

Without sounding like I'm patting myself on the back TOO hard, a lot of the racer models on display at Planes of Fame are mine.

But the MAIII isn't one....

[Peashooter]

Re: MA-III?

Without sounding like I'm patting myself on the back TOO hard, a lot of the racer models on display at Planes of Fame are mine.

Thanks Speed for your work. The model display is stunning. We were amazed at every turn. BTW, are the Yanks Museum planes airworthy?

[Unregistered]

Re: MA-III?

Yes they are, at one time they would even have Steve Hinton test fly each new restoration as it came out of the shop. Now they do not fly them even once. A shame, but understandable. The Airacobra is stunning.
They had the F5 Lightning on display today, in company with the old Frank Taylor Lightning and the Air Museum's. The Museum's flew today and even did some rolls. Nice.

[AirDOGGe]

Re: MA-III?

Something I was constantly thinking about.....

I can see how a Lear wing could improve a 'Stang's performance on a point-to-point speed race, but did it really provide much advantage on a tight closed-circuit pulling G's? I know the Lear was never designed for tight turns (as in dogfighting), and a clipped and polished P-51 laminar-flow wing is pretty slick to being with....Just wondering...

[John H]

Re: MA-III?

With regards to the Yanks airplanes, how can an airplane be listed as airworthy if they never run its' engines and it never flies? The only stuff I've ever heard about flying at Yanks the past 14 years are the Staggerwing and the Mustang. None of the other warbirds have.

John

[Peashooter]

Re: MA-III?

Something I was constantly thinking about.....

I can see how a Lear wing could improve a 'Stang's performance on a point-to-point speed race, but did it really provide much advantage on a tight closed-circuit pulling G's? I know the Lear was never designed for tight turns (as in dogfighting), and a clipped and polished P-51 laminar-flow wing is pretty slick to being with....Just wondering...

Here's a link to some Learjet lore:

http://www.centennialofflight.gov/essay/GENERAL_AVIATION/lear/GA13.htm

We need an interview with John Dilley and Bill Rogers to learn the rationale behind the Lear wing. What constituted a "better wing"?

[First time Juke]

Re: MA-III?

This Spit thang MA III reminded me of this video clip..you all seen it ?

http://www.alexisparkinn.com/oh_my_god.htm

Pretty hairrising eh ?

Is that a B-17 parked at the right side of the screen at the end ?