Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

[MustangFan]

Looking through the various posted photos of this year's Unlimited field, I've noticed that several of the Sea Fury's (Dreadnought, Spirit of Texas) were running what appeared to be air scoops on the top of the engine cowling, while most if not all of the other Fury's were not using them. Anyone out there care to enlighten me as to the reason for the scoops? Better cooling? Forced induction system of some sort? Any and all information would be appreciated......

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

Anyone out there care to enlighten me as to the reason for the scoops? Better cooling? Forced induction system of some sort? Any and all information would be appreciated......

I'm sure you'll get a lot of answers on this one, I'll add what I've discussed with a few crew members over the years.. The induction system on the wing root air scoop airplanes is pretty convoluted. Lots of bends and long runs. By putting the scoop on top of the cowl, you get rid of all that and also have a bit more ramair induction as well..

On the Sea Furys, I think their oil coolers are located in the wing root so you'll usually see them keep the scoops there for this purpose.. on the Bearcat, from what I understand, the cooler is behind/below the engine and you could, probably, lose the wing inlets alltogether if you were to go with a cowl scoop on that airplane..

Experts, correct me where I'm wrong.. ??

Wayne

[John]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

I'm sure you'll get a lot of answers on this one, I'll add what I've discussed with a few crew members over the years.. The induction system on the wing root air scoop airplanes is pretty convoluted. Lots of bends and long runs. By putting the scoop on top of the cowl, you get rid of all that and also have a bit more ramair induction as well..

On the Sea Furys, I think their oil coolers are located in the wing root so you'll usually see them keep the scoops there for this purpose.. on the Bearcat, from what I understand, the cooler is behind/below the engine and you could, probably, lose the wing inlets alltogether if you were to go with a cowl scoop on that airplane..

Experts, correct me where I'm wrong.. ??

Wayne

Hey Wayne,
They'd probably get more ram on the bearcat with cowl induction, but I was thinking it sure would look ugly! (ha)

[jarrodeu]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

It would probably cut down on visibility too.
Jarrod

[speeddemon]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

So you guys have never seen pictures of Shelton's Bearcat from Mojave '76 when it ran as "Spirit of 77" then, eh? That was the year that Bill Statler Sr. installed a down-draft system on the Bearcat, and it had a scoop on top of the cowl (looking similar to Wildfire, Mr. Awesome, etc.). I would say it was 'distinct' looking in kind of a cool-but-ugly way.

Didn't last very long, though. Lyle bellied the plane in during qualifiying, and it didn't fly again until 1980...by which time he had gone back to a stock F8F cowl and induction system.

Between the low profile canopy the Bear has, and the height of the intake, I've heard Lyle say that forward visibility was down to about nothing.

Bell Cobra IV doesn't stick his head in here much anymore, but he might have some good insight on how 'well' it worked, and such.

[440_Magnum]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

Looking through the various posted photos of this year's Unlimited field, I've noticed that several of the Sea Fury's (Dreadnought, Spirit of Texas) were running what appeared to be air scoops on the top of the engine cowling, while most if not all of the other Fury's were not using them. Anyone out there care to enlighten me as to the reason for the scoops? Better cooling? Forced induction system of some sort? Any and all information would be appreciated......

The Sea Fury stock engine is a Bristol Centaurus. It uses an "updraft" carburetor (like a Merlin) which sucks air in on the bottom. The stock intake splits below the carb and goes to intakes on the wing roots, the left side one being just inboard of the oil cooler inlet.

Then people started putting R-3350s and R4360s in the Sea Fury- those engines use downdraft carburetors with the air intake on TOP, so to hook up to a stock Sea Fury induction system there has to be a complete 180-degree turn in the intake trunking IN ADDITION to the split and other turns needed to get to the wing-root intakes, which reduces the pressure at the carb. Dreadnought (I think) was the first to use the cowl-top scoop with the inlet on the leading edge of the cowl, and it worked well. Only a 90-degree bend in the intake trunking, no "Y" in the trunking, good ram pressure, and no other twists and turns. Mike Brown tried a Skyraider-style cowl top intake (set back from the nose, with inlet guide vanes, directly over the carburetor) on September Fury, but the nose seemed eliminate the wanted ram pressure increase and he switched to a Dreadnought-style scoop. Spirit of Texas added the Dreadnought-style cowl scoop a few years ago. The other nice thing the cowl scoops allow is for the wing-root intakes to be covered, cleaning up the air flow at the wing roots.

[440_Magnum]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

Bell Cobra IV doesn't stick his head in here much anymore, but he might have some good insight on how 'well' it worked, and such.

I sure wish he would (stick his head in here, that is). I'd love to hear his take on that, as well as the current wing mod (if he could without revealing too much secret $&!#)

[ignomini]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

Riff Raff must have learned the same lesson as Mike Brown. They ran a modified looking Skyraider scoop briefly last year, but ditched it during qualifying.

I'm guessing Cook Cleland deserves credit for being the first post war racer to run the setup on his Super Carsairs.

[Lockheed Bob]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

The Corsairs with the 4360 engine had the scoop on the top.Cook Cleland didn't invent them as they came that way from the factory.In fact several of them blew those scoops during the Cleveland Air Races.
Lockheed Bob

[Low-n-Slow]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

They'd probably get more ram on the bearcat with cowl induction, but I was thinking it sure would look ugly! (ha)

Yeah, but it's a Bearcat, how could it get MORE ugly

(runs dodging and weaving for the nearest bomb shelter )

Low

[Peashooter]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

Yeah, but it's a Bearcat, how could it get MORE ugly

(runs dodging and weaving for the nearest bomb shelter )

Low

C'mon Low, you know that a Bearcat is like the cutest girl on the field hockey team...she carries a big stick.

[speeddemon]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

The Corsairs with the 4360 engine had the scoop on the top.Cook Cleland didn't invent them as they came that way from the factory.In fact several of them blew those scoops during the Cleveland Air Races.
Lockheed Bob

Only partly true. As from the factory, the scoop on the 'stock' F2G's was at the trailing edge of the cowling (aka Skyraider, Riff Raff, Sept Fury circa 2001). In testing, Cleland found that they were not getting the kind of induction that they hoped for during the turns, so they fabricated 'extended' scoops that went to the leading edge of the engine cowling. This modification was done on Cleland's #74, and Becker's #94, for the 1947 season, but it was NOT done on the stable's third plane, #84. This was the plane flown by Tony Janazzo/Ben Jacoby (take your pick) which crashed fatally during the Thompson.

In 1948, Cleland and Becker switched aircraft, but many of the racers suffered from 'backfires' due to the experimental Triptane fuel that was provided by Sohio for the event. This backfire is what caused the scoop 'extensions' to be blown askew on both the Cleland Corsairs.

Both were back in place for the '49 Thompson, and by then Cleland had managed to get his hands on another Corsair (through under the table methods), which was run as #57 by Ben McKillen. This is the plane that Bob Odegaard had at Reno this year. Bob's restoration isn't 100% accurate, since anyone who has seen photos of that plane in 1949 knows what a monstrosity of a scoop extension was on there. Quite possibly the ugliest one I've ever seen.

So yes, the F2G's DID come from the factory with a down-draft carburator and scoop on top, but the 'extensions' (which is the subject of this thread) were purely a homemade addition.

[stuntflyr]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

And your story is also only partially true.

NATC did tests with a full hood scoop and their design was on the last Cook Cleland airplane, #57, the airplane Bob Odegard now owns. The boxy full scoop that the airplane flew with in '49 was from the leading edge of the cowling with a large box for the incoming air to diffuse within before heading down the throat of the inlet to the carburetter. This very well may be a superior set-up to gain the maximum ram effect for the carburetter, regardless of it's appearence. I think that somewhere along the long hard road this airplane took back to airworthiness, the original disappeared. Bob Odegard mounted what looks like a copy of the homemade jobs that Cleland put together for #74 and #94.

Some Goodyear factory/Navy test F2G's did have full scoops from the leading edge of the cowling, #57 had one. The Cleland guys built their own low profile versions for #94 and #74.

Chris...

[MustangFan]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

Wow, thanks to everyone for the replies. I had forgotten that Sept. Fury and Riff Raff had tried the Skyraider intakes. And I had NO IDEA that Odegaard's Corsair is one of the original Cook Cleland racers! That makes it even cooler that he's still flying that thing, much less doing aerobatic routines in it. I know it's too valuable to risk it, but wouldn't it be something to see that beast turning the pylons again? Certainly would make the unlimited field more interesting.

[John]

Re: Sea Fury "Hood Scoops"

Yeah, but it's a Bearcat, how could it get MORE ugly

(runs dodging and weaving for the nearest bomb shelter )

Low

I'm with you on that Low-n-Slow, the peculiar thing is that as I've started
to get older (and slightly fatter) the Bear is becoming more appealing to me. lol.