When did it happen?

[matt]

Re: When did it happen?

mike, part of that problem is that the races are almost all sea furies anyway, atleast half of the competition at reno is sea furies. don't get me wrong they're loads of fun to watch but i do like my mustangs and bearcats and the occasional other 'cat'.

the only real answer i can think of is to get rid of the parker rule, find some body to fund the custom projects and let them battle it out with the warbirds, however as was previously discussed here on this thread that's not gonna happen time soon. so, as i see at this point unlimiteds are pretty doomed within the next 15 years or so as engines continue to run out and any remaining *racers* turned back to stock or put into museums.

[Wild Bill Kelso]

Re: When did it happen?

the only real answer i can think of is to get rid of the parker rule, find some body to fund the custom projects and let them battle it out with the warbirds

Can open... worms everywhere I going to the airport manager right now!

[Race 29]

Re: When did it happen?

I think everyone agrees that the sport needs more money. More money for each event if we are to have a series. Everyone say's "get more and bigger sponsors to foot the bill" But there's a problem with that, sponsors aren't going to dump big bucks into an advertising campaign for just a couple thousand people. There was another thred where someone wondered why the Red Bull air races were getting so much attention. I'll tell you why....they have a good team in the head office!! They get their event televised, billboard adds, local news stories, massive internet marketing, etc. The few Reno events that have been televised had editing and on air talent that ranked somewhere between Thomas the Train and the Teletubbies. Even Nascar had shows like that in the 70's. But as they pushed the issue more and more towards being considered a top level sporting event, the sponsorship money started rolling in, and they put on better shows and attracted more viewers. For years it was a "Good 'ol Boy only" sport, now look at it. There are some out there that only want Reno, and Reno only. They don't like the idea of Air Racing no longer being so exclusive. There are those out there who have an absolute hatred towards Red Bull. Probably because they bought Lefty's P-38 and had the audacity to take an almost destroyed P-38 and spend a ton of cash getting it back in the air. Red Bull is one of the VERY few corporations who has shown a tendancy to help further Warbird aviation, and we need to embrace that. I'm not saying that I'd die for Red Bull, but they're just about the only ones showing a keen interest in warbirds and air racing, albiet not at the same time yet. I personally would love to see Pepsi funding a warbird or air racer, how about KFC, Microsoft, Nextel, Minute Maid, etc. Can you see my point? We need to have an audience that sponsors will want to advertise to. They have the money, and believe me, they want to spend it. But they don't want to waste it.

Right now RARA pretty much runs the show on air racing. What we need is a true National Organisation to make decisions and run the series. Every national sport has a governing body and that's what Air Racing needs instead of each event having their own, to look out for their interest alone. They can set the purses the same for each event across the board, and handle series sponsorship issues, event licensing, safety, advertising, rule book, Championship points, etc. This by no means would mean overnight success, but I think it would be a step in the right direction. I think it could be the first step. Once we have something advertisers will want to support, then we can tackle the other issues with that money. Reliablity takes money, technology takes money, see my point? Flame away!

Race 29

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: When did it happen?

The few Reno events that have been televised had editing and on air talent that ranked somewhere between Thomas the Train and the Teletubbies.

Oh man... http://www.aafo.com/vid/ hurt me Larry... hurt me... *snif*...

I may have been green but... a teletubbie?? I was pretty skinny that year!!



My girlfriend and my mom thought I did OK...

[Wild Bill Kelso]

Re: When did it happen?

I could never flame that 29. You have spent your time in other motorsports and have seen what it can be. I see all the sick camara angles in Moto GP these days and just wonder what air racing would be like if each airplane had four mini cams.Each one with just a little different angle. That and a hot nugget calling the shots. Sorry Wayne Jamie Little is freaking hot and she could talk motors with the best of us. For those of you who don't know who she is watch a AMA Supercross some time. The show gets the money, the money gets us a better race budget, the better race budget gets you more R&D, more R&D gets you an airplane that will run full zoot all season long, or give you enough money to make sparrow a very happy guy(not saying that he isn't). Because now he can build you four race engines.

Reno as a city is changing too. It is not as much as a casino town as it was ten years ago. The casino's of Reno don't kick down as much money as they used to, or do the marketing of years past. Yet Microsoft, Yahoo, Amazon.com, and many others call it home now. The market has changed but we have not. I hope these other races really take hold. The Reno monopoly needs a shake up, or air racing is dead... again.

[matt]

Re: When did it happen?

Can open... worms everywhere I going to the airport manager right now!

well, i've adopted the theory of not opening my piehole unless i truly think i can bring something to the table, as opposed to my previous theory of "the beatings will continue until morale improves", and when i do make it short and to the point.

hey mike, wanna help me with my worms here? they're all over... lol, couldn't pass that up...

[Peashooter]

Re: When did it happen?

Wayne: The truth is that air racing will always be a niche sport until the unlikely day that we're all jetting around in Mohler Air-Cars. (Damn, where's my Popular Mechanix?) Realistically, we'll never see a series that makes money for everyone. That requires sponsors, who require many millions of eyeballs, clicks and impressions. My media background says "no-way".

Now, if I owned an unlimited and I only had x-dollars to spend on racing each year, I'd fly the "main event", which as of now is still Reno. If another venue was close, I might go and just stroke it, but I'd save the bent throttles for Reno.

For some fortunate racers, the solution might be fewer airplanes, more engines, more races...

Reality Bites! Peas

[440_Magnum]

Re: When did it happen?

Well I am not smart enough to come up with a solution, but I know what I don't want to see, and that is restricted unlimiteds. Many NASCAR drivers won't say a thing because they are afraid of Big Brother, but almost to a man, they HATE the plate races.

And, unlike most current NASCAR fans, I HATE watching them. A driver can get shuffled from the front to 35th spot on the last lap after leading the previous 10 laps just by a random gust of wind that catches his car poorly- nothing to do with his driving, nothing to do with his engine shop, nothing to do with his car. That's not racing, its entirely artificial. I much preferred the days when Richard Petty or David Pearson would win by 7 laps because the team was so dang much better at building cars and engines and they were so much better at driving them. THAT, was racing in the big picture. The whole idea that a race is "great" because the margin of victory is .03 seconds just annoys me.

We all talk about how we'd like to see more "innovative" racers or the elusive purpose-built racer and look at those in the past: Griffon contra-props like Red Baron, the evolution of Rare Bear and Conquest One, Tsunami, Critical Mass, September Fury, the Pond Racer, Strega, Dago, Voodoo, Stilletto, Dreadnought... and yet a complex rulebook would have pretty much prevented any of those from ever happening. What owner/builder/designer is going to lay down the bucks and multi-year effort to innovate an exotic racer with *zero* other uses, if there's a chance that a NASCAR-style "the rulebook is written in pencil" change might render it completely valueless in an instant?

[Leo]

Re: When did it happen?

I don't have any real solutions. Money and media are the answer, I think to being able to support multiple events, and even then the unlimiteds would be difficult simply by the time and expense it takes to keep them in trim. Racers like Dread WOULD definately have an edge in a points system, forcing a definate change in the way these racers are modified and run.
Most non-fans I know have either never heard of or do not know when the Reno event is. there is little coverage of it outside the aviation community.
Back in the early 70's I learned about it thru several sources. Knowing I had an interest in old planes (the room filled with models and books was a givaway) my dad would call me in for the Wide World of Sports coverage. My brother was into auto racing and several of his publications had a story on it every year. I discovered Air Classics in 72 and it always covered Reno and Mojave. So did every other mag, even Flying. Point being, if there was little notice of it outside of the devout, I never would have gotten interested.
Last few years there has been little coverage. A few radio and TV ads locally is all I've seen, maybe an ad in AC. Mags such as Pacific Flyer stopped covering it because the atmosphere to them was "hostile". I'm sure others would report the same experience. I don't speak from experience, I've never been press there.
To me, an ad budget would be a big boon for the whole sport. Play it up, get people and sponsers excited about it. A lot could be done with sound and some of the great videos and photo's. We all lament the fact that as a niche sport the only interest is from the aviation oriented. It needs to be SOLD. If they can get us to buy oversweetened caffiene, we'll buy anything.
Get the fans there and the money will follow.

[Wild Bill Kelso]

Re: When did it happen?

Wayne: The truth is that air racing will always be a niche sport until the unlikely day that we're all jetting around in Mohler Air-Cars.

Oh man my father worked for Supertrapp(Mohler was the parent company). His R&D shop was right next to where that thing was be developed. Thanks for that memory flash back.
Back to the topic... I think we will continue to grow. The country is nuts about motorsports on a whole new level these days. People have fallen in love with racing, and many don't care if it rolls or flys. If it has the sound and thrills they will come. I went out and people watched at the air races as I always have. The type of people coming to the event isn't so much changing, but new race fans type are coming to watch. The NASCAR fans are coming to see what it's all about. I met more than a few people that stated in almost the same way. "I never knew they raced airplanes". Almost all of them said that they would now be long term fans. Because they loved the sound, smell, and the colorful aircraft. Yet most could not tell you the difference between a Mustang and a Sea Fury. Access to the pits is also a big draw to these new fans. Air Racing is one of the few motorsports where the fans can access the pits. Which means that they have access to the pilots and the crews. Race fans love that kinda stuff... they eat it up.

[Leo]

Re: When did it happen?

I agree FNG, it has all the elements. You dont have to know airplanes to love it, just as you don't need to know a Ford from a Chevy to like Nascar.
It just needs someone willing to take the risk (attention RARA) to SELL it.
I do my little part, liscense plates, pictures on the office wall and annoying everyone I know...

[Race 29]

Re: When did it happen?

Wayne,
NO WAY am I talking about your stuff!!! I'm talking about the national media coverage. Ya know, the two ESPN guys who would put their hands on the leading edge of a wing, look into the camera, and say "This is an airplane". Come on!!! I've never seen a NASCAR race where the announcer would even dare to say "This is a car". That's the type of thing I'm talking about. Believe me, you've done great with AAFO, I think the networks need someone like you to be running the show!!

Every few years this subject comes up (if not EVERY year). But it really seems as though we run into a big fat brick wall as far as RARA goes. I don't know if it's Mike Houghton (spelling?) or someone else in the organization, but it really does look like they don't want the sport to grow, or at least have too much media coverage. It would be so easy to bill the races as NASCAR to the 10th power. More noise, more speed, more entertainment, more BEER!!! We'd see more and more fans like the ones FNG saw. The question SHOULD be, what can we (as fans) do about RARA. That's the first hurdle to forming a true National governing body. Nothing more will happen in air racing without media coverage!!

Race 29
(Publicly professing my plutonic love of Wayne Sagar!)

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: When did it happen?

NO WAY am I talking about your stuff!!! I'm talking about the national media coverage. Ya know, the two ESPN guys who would put their hands on the leading edge of a wing, look into the camera, and say "This is an airplane".

LOL Larry... I'm kiddin ya buddy.. In 2000, I "CO-Anchored" a one hour pilot for what would have been a 1/2 hour weekly series called "World of Wings". The episode taped at Reno was "People Passion Pistons and Power".

Jeff Lee directed this newbie to a somewhat acceptable "performance" and I, along with Mitch Carley and Dave deVos managed to pull it off. It only aired on what was then "Speedvision" about 12 times or so... obviously, the series didn't sell so it became one of those "one off" things that through contractual limitations, could not be made available via DVD or tape.

Amateurish... Nervous.. Yes... Teletubbie... I sure hope not...

"Let's go out on the course to Dave deVos to take a look"...

Those who were there will remember Dave's most indelible line...

"Thanks Wayne"....

"did anybody get a white balance on that"....

You'd have had to be there...

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: When did it happen?

Getting back on topic:

Ok... In case you guys haven't figured it out, I've been playing "Devil's Advocate" here with my "restrictor plate" suggestion.

Trust me, I love Reno, its history, the all out efforts to make the mark.. all of it. Those of you who know me, know this. I work hard to help promote and grow the sport and what I'm trying to accomplish here is that goal.

With all the discussion we've thrown about, we still wind up at the same place.

New venues are opening up and getting the top competitors there in consistently viable numbers is going to be difficult, at best... at worst, they won't show and the sport will either not grow or, grow without them..

OK... for the sake of further "discussion"....

What if..

The power setting rule were only in effect for the "series" part of the deal, enabling racers to have true "competition".. NOT demo racing with voluntary power reductions but really true competition. Maybe just do it with normal pump fuel?

That would certainly make VOLUNTEER reductions necessary!

Have a points system in place where the more races you attend, the better your starting position at the national championships, or, hopefully, have a sponsor on board that made an incentive prize available to those who went to the most effort and did the best through the year's races...

Then, at those championships, HELD AT RENO, all stops are out, do just as always, run exotic fuels, engine busting parameters.. go for broke win the championship race!

Would this appease the "win or break" mentality we've been expressing here?

[Race 29]

Re: When did it happen?

Wayne,
I've seen the trailor, and that's the kind of exciting stuff we need to grab people. If that commercial was ran a couple times during a NASCAR telecast, we'd get some serious interest. We also need to bill the racers, not as 50 year old technology, but as one off exotic racers. Splash it across the screen that it's the worlds fastest motorsport. The editing on that trailor grabbed the excitement of the sport IMHO!! If the American public sees something like that, they'll want more.

Race 29