IT's about F'ing time!

[chuckd]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

I never knew Mr Zueschel personally but I wish I had. Was that Ranchero called "The Roach", I have a friend who is in a/c mx who helped Dave a bit when he was younger, he told me many stories about him and how much fun it was to hang out and help him, I remember also seeing Dave at Reno the year Stilletto(Color Tile) was puffing smoke around the course and was standing in front of the airplane when he was pulling the plugs on it, he was in his white smock with shorts on and turned to someone and said "there's nothing wrong with this engine", he wasn't too happy, it made me laugh because of the stories I had heard about him, just the look on his face. An extremely talented, intelligent and funny man.

[goglidegood]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

Hi Ryan and Chuck-

Good messages.

Ryan – you are right on. Those mirror-polished warbirds look nice but not authentic. N86Z was the coolest F-86. Dave had me walk up to put my hand in the gunports and I couldn’t. Optical illusion! He had the guns ports painted with a fade to give it depth, but it was just a flat panel of aluminum. Very slick.

At that young age, I thought that airplanes and especially warbirds and air racing were all there was. But Dave and especially Matt Jackson encouraged me to go to school. Matt has always told me that one can have a life in aviation without having a “life in aviation.”

The deal is that the timing was right for me. With all the restrictions to access and security issues now, it would be hard to be an airport kid just bumming around. So, Ryan, keep following your interests.

Ryan – you mentioned to consider ourselves lucky. Knowing these guys was indeed fortunate. But as one of novelist friends in D.C. told me: “You should only want to live in your own time.” So, that extracted means that you have the life that is meant for you. So you will have your own fortunate experiences.

Chuck – Dave had two 1972 Rancheros – the orange one I mentioned and a black one with silver stripes. Maybe that one was “The Roach.” I think he had a 1969 or 1970 Mustang and also a Gran Torino...

Dick Dawes was an old Air Force transport pilot who kept a sweet orange Stearman in a hangar at Van Nuys. He once told me a story that’s maybe apocryphal and possibly embellished: Dave Zeuschel enrolled in an animal husbandry class at the local community college which is an aggie school. When Dave heard that he had to wear an elbow-length glove and put it in a heifer cow, he dropped out of school...!

-George Constantin

John Slack: did you work on Stiletto? If you did, then I may have met you then. Why is your handle “BellCobraIV”...?

[goglidegood]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

Dave had two 1972 Rancheros – the orange one I mentioned and a black one with silver stripes. Maybe that one was “The Roach.” I think he had a 1969 or 1970 Mustang and also a Gran Torino...

I messed up ... Dave had a 1970s model Mach 1 Mustang painted metallic green, now that I remember. It just came back to me 20 years later ... not sure about the Torino...

-George

[speeddemon]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

John Slack: did you work on Stiletto? If you did, then I may have met you then. Why is your handle “BellCobraIV”...?[/COLOR][/COLOR]

I know, I know, I know.......


But I would stop short on saying that John Slack ever actually WORKED.....on ANYTHING.

[goglidegood]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

I know, I know, I know.......


But I would stop short on saying that John Slack ever actually WORKED.....on ANYTHING.

Speed / John-

Funny razz on John...

I'm sure John gets asked about his handle a lot. The reason I ask is that in the weeks preceding Stiletto's debut at Reno '84, Van Nuys was loaded with a race team with many new people I hadn't met before.

John is probably too young to have been this guy, but one of the race crew Dave Z had working was a Huey Cobra pilot in Viet Nam. I remember talking to him and mentioning the narrow fuselage of the Cobra, and he said: “Same as the Mustang here; just thirty-six inches.”

So, with “BellCobraIV” handle here (unless it means Airacobra or Kingcobra) and connection to Zeuschel, that’s what got me asking.

There were like ten additional guys around on top of everyone else. I remember the team filling Stiletto's wings with does after dose of water from those plastic five-gallon water cooler bottles.

I recall that one gun bay and wing tank on Stiletto was water coolant, and the other for fuel. Stiletto wouldn’t need a duration much longer than thirty minutes past Reno per FAA rules, right?

In its bare metal form Stiletto was impressive.

-George

[Race5]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

I'm not sure what the range was on Stilletto, but it would run out of fuel before it ran out of water and ADI. I would assume it had a somewhat decent range or they could'nt have ferried it to Stead for the races.

[BellCobraIV]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

Those mirror-polished warbirds look nice but not authentic. N86Z was the coolest F-86. Dave had me walk up to put my hand in the gunports and I couldn’t. Optical illusion! He had the guns ports painted with a fade to give it depth, but it was just a flat panel of aluminum. Very slick.

George,
You would know better than most would about N86Z, When Dave and I went down to Van Nuys to take the Sabre out of the hangar Dave commented on the job you had done cleaning and polishing the area behind the speed brakes. Dave said something to me that day that changed my life also in retrospect. Dave did not want to go to the Air Show in Shafter on that day, the Sabre had been sold, it was leaving the next week. I asked Dave why was he going then? He replied that he had made comittments to the guys to bring the Sabre.
Now If I don't want to go somewhere I just don't.

Chuck – Dave had two 1972 Rancheros – the orange one I mentioned and a black one with silver stripes. Maybe that one was “The Roach.” I think he had a 1969 or 1970 Mustang and also a Gran Torino...

Dave loved the '72 Roaches, they were both roaches, the Orange car had a 429 SCJ engine in it and the Black one had a 460 SCJ engine in it both by Dave of course. The Mustang Dave had was a '71 429 Ram Air car that was not a Mach 1, 4:30 gear car with a locker, and of Dave had a Cobra that came from Brian Anglis in England. The 1969 428 CJ Mustang belonged to Little Dave and that was one of the very few things Annette did not F**k the kids on. Little Dave and I went down to Van Nuys airport and took that car to his mothers house in Palmdale before Annette really knew what was going on one afternoon. One of the things that most airplane guys missed is that Dave really was one of the greatest car guys there ever was, Dave was the prototype car guy.

Dick Dawes was an old Air Force transport pilot who kept a sweet orange Stearman in a hangar at Van Nuys.

That was George Byards Stearman Dick Dawes was never an airplane owner but he played one at the skytrails often.

-George Constantin

John Slack: did you work on Stiletto? If you did, then I may have met you then. Why is your handle “BellCobraIV”...?

No I did not get to work on Stiletto, one of the things I really missed, I was up the ramp with Bondo Betty, The Rare Bear belonged to my dad, so until branched out in about 1987 I stayed pretty much there, after I officially went to work with Dave in January of 1987, the day before my birthday to be exact.


My relationship with Dave went back to the Apple Valley airshow in 1971, when as a 12 year old kid I went with my dad and mom to the show to see some of his friends fly that day. While I was standing there I saw a man leaning on a Mustang wing, I started to talk with him not knowing him at that point, he asked me if I liked airplanes and talked to me not at me, I told him yes, but I really loved the engines. Dave then asked me what I wanted to do with engines, I told him it didn't matter the guys with my dad's Bearcat didn't care to teach me anything about engines. So next Dave asked "what do you want to know, Slick?" "What is a piston?" I asked and for the next three hours Dave planted seeds. At the end of the deal he told me to read because the other guys wouldn't and that would give me the advantage over them. Afterwards whenever I would see Dave I would ask him questions and he would part answer them and tell me what to go read for the rest of the answer. There was the time in late 1973 when I saw Dave at the hotel during an air show and asked him "hey, I was reading about a bigger Merlin, called a Griifon can you put one of those in a Mustang?" Dave looked at me funny like who put me up to that question and told me to ask him later, but, by the way read this book on the late model Spitfires and don't talk to your dad. I could always go to Dave Zeuschel with a real well thought out question and not get an answer that wasn't thought out back. Dave's sarcasm grew on me and as I became older I sometimes found it advantagious to have learned from the king of the one line stabs. Example from Dave; One of the guys that hung around Van Nuys airport once thought it was his business to interfere with a deal that Dave had put together and this "guy" put holes into Dave's deal and in the ensuing mele ruined a friendship of Dave's. After a couple of months Dave was able to repair the friendship but not the deal. One day the "guy" came up to Dave and said he would do anything to make it up to Dave what could he do? Dave asked the "guy" if he meant it, that he would do anything, to which the "guy' responded if it would make Dave happy and everything would be alright he would do anything. Dave replied "Stay the Hell off my airport, and disappear" then he did what he said and was gone. I can go on about Dave but he is one of the guys that I can honestly say I learned a lot about life from, I was lucky enough to grow up close enough to dave to get to learn from him. Later in life I was lucky enough to learn some really good philosophy from Da' Doc, and let me tell you the one prepared me for the other.

[BellCobraIV]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

I know, I know, I know.......


But I would stop short on saying that John Slack ever actually WORKED.....on ANYTHING.

Oh'wait since we are quoting "Z", I have one.

"nice, real nice", and the last time you ever overexerted anything but your personality was?

I grew up in the gulch Brad, and I've verbally sparred with Dwight Thorn and Steve Bartholf for hours before. In addition to Zeuschel, Thorn, and others I can claim part of my unique personality comes form sparring with the late great Randy Scoville. Now if that isn't a charm schools teachers dream what have you got.

I actually saw "Z" hand a quarter and tell a guy to go get a personality transplant.

You can take the guy out of the gulch but you can't take the gulch out of the guy.

[goglidegood]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

Beautiful recollections, John ... really nice.

I can tell you were and are a reader ... like how you mentioned Dave told you to keep reading. Your posts are always well-written. (I teach English 101 part-time at that same "aggie school" Dave went to I mentioned in the post above, and your writing is very coherent and well-structured...)

I have some more comments I'll post later.

John, is that you in that photo elsewhere on the Rare Bear wing with the head of mop-hair and baby face?

-George

[goglidegood]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

Check out the photo of Dave Zeuschel here in the white button-down...!

http://gassermadness.com/arteaga/BigJohnCrew-Zeuschel.jpg

...and here...

http://cacklefest.com/images/Picture-544.jpg

It comes from this page that has cool pix of Dave with dragster across USA:

http://cacklefest.com/Barnstormer.shtml

Seeing Dave in the old-school "bowling shirts" is awesome!

[goglidegood]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

George,
You would know better than most would about N86Z, When Dave and I went down to Van Nuys to take the Sabre out of the hangar Dave commented on the job you had done cleaning and polishing the area behind the speed brakes.

Hi John-

Thanks for the credit, but I'm not sure that was me ... but maybe it is?

I did help polish the 86 and also some on Joe Kasparoff's P-51 The Healer, but at some point Jack Ward (Ascher's son) started a seemingly full-time gig polishing for Joe that led to Jack flying Mustangs. I was never an A&P but because I was an eager kid, Dave let me “help.” I did in fact do some cleaning on the Sabrejet ... but I’m not sure I did such a good job as this. Another guy named George? That’s cool if I did. But I never had keys to the hangars or anything; Dave showed me how to hop the fence (or at least didn’t have a problem with it) and other cool ways to get into where his hangar was.

How long did your dad own Rare Bear for? I recall seeing it around ’83 or ’84 at the north end of VNY in those covered “roofed” open tie-downs. Then it was in the hangar that was by the old mid-'80s Ken McInturff Aircraft Sales / King Aviation that is now Million Air. I remember Matt Jackson singing in a mellifluous voice about Bear’s Bondo: “Bodyman in a can.”

Do you still live in SoCal?

-George

[GregS]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

OUTSTANDING LINK......on the Tommy Ivo story. A must read for any true drag-race fan....Thanx...!!!



Regards,
GregS

[speeddemon]

Re: IT's about F'ing time!

Oh'wait since we are quoting "Z", I have one.

"nice, real nice", and the last time you ever overexerted anything but your personality was?

I grew up in the gulch Brad, and I've verbally sparred with Dwight Thorn and Steve Bartholf for hours before. In addition to Zeuschel, Thorn, and others I can claim part of my unique personality comes form sparring with the late great Randy Scoville. Now if that isn't a charm schools teachers dream what have you got.

I actually saw "Z" hand a quarter and tell a guy to go get a personality transplant.

You can take the guy out of the gulch but you can't take the gulch out of the guy.

I can top that, John.....

I was married to my ex-wife for 16 years.

END GAME.

You know...when you said "Nice...real nice"....I swear to God I could hear it in Z's voice. Spooky...and yet kinda nice at the same time. Kinda like the eulogy I wrote for RLP's memorial....somewhere up there there is one hell of a hangar party going on, and all those crazy lovable bastards must be cooking up one hell of a racer scam! How great to have had the opportunity to 'know' the guys who truly are the legends of the game, you know? And not just to know them...but as you have pointed out, to have been an 'everyday part' of their lives, and have them be a part of yours. You take a little bit away from everyone and their thoughts, their attitudes, their standards...they all live on inside of you. You come to a crossroads for a project--sometimes having NOTHING to do with racing or airplanes or engines--and you'll stop and go "Hmmmmmm....now what would ______ have done?"

ALWAYS makes me stop and smile just a little bit. And as long as that keeps happening, that little part of them you took away is still 'alive'.

[zeusbear]

Thanks So Much!

I wanted to take a moment to thank all of you who have shared all those great stories about our Dad. I was not looking forward to this week at all, marking the 20th year without him. I felt such comfort and love from all of your stories and memories about him. It made this time so much easier for me. I loved the old drag pictures, they were great!!

I have a funny story that I remember...........Dad was test flying Jeannie at Van Nuys and he had to belly it in at the corn fields at the end of the runway. I heard his response was "What took you a--holes so long to come get me!" He also wanted us to bring bags for all the corn he said he just bought. Later that evening they towed Jeannie back to the air port down the street, we passed a bar and there was a drunk outside that pointed at the plane and said" Ahhh, the airport is that way" as he pointed in every direction. Dad yelled out "Thanks goomba" and off we went.
Please keep sharing your stories with us. My boys love to read about their Grandfather! I tell them about him all the time, and what a great time they would have had with him. My younger son Dalton is 16 and he is so much like Dad, he really would have given him a run. He has quicker come back comments than Dad ever did and his mind is so mechanical it is scary the things he builds and designs.
Thank you again..............Denise (Bear)
For you John "There's no class like LOW class" HaHaHa Talk to you soon.

[BellCobraIV]

Re: Thanks So Much!

For you John "There's no class like LOW class" HaHaHa Talk to you soon.

Whiskey for my friends!

Remind me to tell you about the story of "Z" smarting off to a cop and getting handcuffed to the fence, while supporting Don Moody, in the Zeuschel-Moody-Fuller days. Moody wished they left him cuffed to the fence by the end of the day. It was great to taslk with you Bear, I look forward to seeing both you and Big Mike.