How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

[MRussell]

Re: one point though...

...when the owner of the airplane specifies ... a cross country requirement, I imagine the compromise works out to keeping the coolant on-board rather than dumping it overboard as it's used. The instrument panel starts sprouting widgets not required for the pylons as well.
Cheers
Gerry

And of course, one of those widgets proved ultimately to be the undoing of Tsunami... the flap handle. JRS wanted flaps to make her more flyable for regular folks (he) on landing. Mr. B perferred to build her without them. But JRS got his flaps, and we all know what unfortunately happened next involving the flaps. Man I wish someone would take on the task of rebuilding her (without flaps, thank you). I would take every fansponsor dime I gave the Bear team and find a way to double it or more, just to help the effort.

[forbergler]

Re: one point though...

And of course, one of those widgets proved ultimately to be the undoing of Tsunami... the flap handle. JRS wanted flaps to make her more flyable for regular folks (he) on landing. Mr. B perferred to build her without them. But JRS got his flaps, and we all know what unfortunately happened next involving the flaps. Man I wish someone would take on the task of rebuilding her (without flaps, thank you). I would take every fansponsor dime I gave the Bear team and find a way to double it or more, just to help the effort.

Not to be nit-picky or piss anyone off, but the demise of Tsunami had more to do with the airspeed indicator not working properly, which then led to the flaps being deployed at too great a speed, and one ripping off. But then again, if they hadn't been there in the first place....Tsunami was my all time favorite, and I'd pony up as much money a s I could as well, to see her up in the high desert air again.

[invader696]

Re: How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

The airplane was built without flaps. JRS eventually installed them anyways, however, the real problem with them wasn't that they were installed or that they were deployed at too high of a speed. It was that there was no connecting rod between the two, leading to a split deployment. Skip had already had a problem with this, causing him to tell JRS to not fly the airplane again. This was ignored, and we got the result we all know of.

[Matt Jackson]

Re: How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

Just a couple points to make. Removing the scoop does reduce drag. North Americans original design theory was the thrust produced at the exit duct would negate the drag of the air processed through the cooler. This fact played out correctly as there are several Naca reports substantiating this claim. The thrust however did not negate the parasite drag that was induced by having a wart on the bottom of the aircraft. Removing the the scoop and dog house gave about 15 MPH back on the plane. Stiletto was an example of this. This speed increase was determined with the wing radiators and not the boil off. When I eventually operated the plane with the boil off it was without a doubt the fastest Mustang I have ever flown at given power settings and cruise configurations. The aircraft was 25 knots faster at cruise then any other Race Mustang, and I have flown a few. Every owner has his own criteria. Typically the fastest design is not the best for plane that needs to fly across the country to racing events. Another issue is the doubt of many on if it worked or not. I can still remember the clammer on the ramp when I showed up in 1992 with the plane. Everyone thought I was having cooling problems. In reality the cooling system was the only thing that worked. I was dealing with a sick engine from day one. In regards to John Sandberg a good friend. He was forever changing Bruce's original design. John was a hands on owner designer and self proclaimed engineer. He drove Bruce crazy. The flaps were so he could take the aircraft into the small airport where is was based. The flaps afforded better visibility for the final approach. I spoke many times about this with him. The failure of the flaps were based on the automotive rod end that he utilized on the flap actuators. He also had no flap interconnect. When I discussed this with him, he said he designed it like the Wildcat flap system. Skip flew the aircraft and indicated that when the flaps were lowered one of them lead the other just long enough to make the aircraft roll about 30 degrees before it stabilized. Skip determined that if the aircraft was at a low enough airspeed that the roll tendency was substantially reduced. I spoke with John at Reno about the rod ends and he just shrugged his shoulders and said "they would be fine". Bruce and I noticed that the rod ends were actually tube locked when in the full down position and thus was actually bending the rod end with the flaps in the down position. Again John just smiled and said it was alright. Obviously it was not. I believe in the accident report that it was determined that one of the rod ends failed allowing the one flap to essentially slam into the up position and thus causing an uncontrollable roll at low altitude in the pattern. John was never told to not fly the plane. He was told to not deploy the flaps at high speed until he installed an interconnect and different rod ends. Skip was scheduled to fly the plane back to MN. for John. John decided that he wanted to return the plane himself. Who knows, it could have been Skip in the plane instead of John. As Skip has always said "Its better to be lucky then Good" The flaps were a thing of beauty and would have worked nicely with a bit of development. Time has a way of distorting the facts in peoples minds. At the time, none of us believed any of these issues would have been fatal, especially with Skip or John at the controls.

[Ken from PG]

Re: one point though...

[Tsunami was my all time favorite, and I'd pony up as much money as I could as well, to see her up in the high desert air again.[/QUOTE]


Sharon is at Reno every year and although it has been a few since I talked to her, her passion was to get Tsunami back there. Not necessarily to race but just to fly for everyone. Her web site looks like things are still the same.

http://www.speedpropsandpylons.com/jrs_tsunami/promoting_tsunami.htm

[kiwiracefan]

Re: How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

Again Matt, i have got to thank you for your time and insight on the various posts that crop up here, its great for me way down here in NZ where we get maybe a 2 page spread in the aviation monthlys if we are lucky.
I love reading as many posts as possible to try and learn as much as possible to feed my hunger for race knowledge is great and the boards here are great for feeding that hunger. I am definately targeting making Reno in 2009 when Kiwi thunder heads for Reno

[David E. Wells]

Re: How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

QUESTION: Would it be possible to replenish the boil-off reservoir from the ADI tank to add delivery range?...D.

[forbergler]

Re: How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

QUESTION: Would it be possible to replenish the boil-off reservoir from the ADI tank to add delivery range?...D.

I would think that not only would it be possible, but most likely very easy.

[Matt Jackson]

Re: How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

Contrary to popular belief. The Mustang with full boil system can be modified with 145 gallons fuel in left main and outboard aux and 110 Gallons ADI in the right light weight main tank. The boiler requires 50% methanol at 9000 density altitude to boil at 100 c @ Race power. This allows the adi system to use the same tankage as the boiler. The boiler uses less water then a typical spraybar system on Dago or Strega during the race. In regards to cross country you run out of fuel before boiler water anyway so traveling isn't so difficult. At the lower power settings and the higher altitudes you can use straight water and keep the temps in check. So all you need is a water hose at your fuel stops. Most of the top Mustang racers don't have any more fuel then 145 gallons anyway so your racer travel range is essencially identical to all the other top end guys.

[hm66sk]

Re: How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

Contrary to popular belief. The Mustang with full boil system can be modified with 145 gallons fuel in left main and outboard aux and 110 Gallons ADI in the right light weight main tank. The boiler requires 50% methanol at 9000 density altitude to boil at 100 c @ Race power. This allows the adi system to use the same tankage as the boiler. The boiler uses less water then a typical spraybar system on Dago or Strega during the race. In regards to cross country you run out of fuel before boiler water anyway so traveling isn't so difficult. At the lower power settings and the higher altitudes you can use straight water and keep the temps in check. So all you need is a water hose at your fuel stops. Most of the top Mustang racers don't have any more fuel then 145 gallons anyway so your racer travel range is essencially identical to all the other top end guys.

Thank you Mr. Jackson for answering my next question concerning "boiler" range before I asked it.

[hm66sk]

Re: How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

Contrary to popular belief. The Mustang with full boil system can be modified with 145 gallons fuel in left main and outboard aux and 110 Gallons ADI in the right light weight main tank. The boiler requires 50% methanol at 9000 density altitude to boil at 100 c @ Race power. This allows the adi system to use the same tankage as the boiler. The boiler uses less water then a typical spraybar system on Dago or Strega during the race. In regards to cross country you run out of fuel before boiler water anyway so traveling isn't so difficult. At the lower power settings and the higher altitudes you can use straight water and keep the temps in check. So all you need is a water hose at your fuel stops. Most of the top Mustang racers don't have any more fuel then 145 gallons anyway so your racer travel range is essencially identical to all the other top end guys.

So, back to my original question then, if fuel will run out before boiler water does, why did Tsunami still incorporate a radiator and doghouse?

[Matt Jackson]

Re: How fast will the "Ghost" Gallop?

You can lead a horse to water , but you can't make him drink. There are a great many things a person can do to make his aircraft faster. Not everyone chooses to incorporate these changes. Many owners chooose to go their own way and establish their own speed secrets. I read your question as implying that if it was not incorporated on Tsunami, how could it be any good? John did a great many things out of the ordinary. One particular item I remember was his insistance on origianlly designing the aircraft around a single stage Merlin. It wasn't until after Johns own flight tests in his stock P51 revealed he had made a poor choice. Every successful Mustang racer of that time out there told him not to use the single stage Merlin. Why would he do it anyway? Also remember that the speeds the plane was designed for increased significantly over the period of time that the aircraft was being built. The plane appeared on the racing scene many years after its original design. It therefore was off the race pace from the start. The aircraft was constantly being changed and improved. I had spoken to John about boiling the aircraft in 1989 even before Stilletto. John was not interested as he believed that the speed gain was not significant enough to warrant the design and packaging issues that were caused by the aircraft small size. I believe that had the aircraft been still around, that John would have eventually come around to boiling. He was willing to try new ideas all the time, and this would have been eventually tried. They just were in his own time. So just because it wasn't on Tsunami doesn't mean it was not and is not a good idea.