Off Topic... But... The Airlines...???

[Scotty G]

That's how SWA plays the game and keeps a presense in a unprofitable market. They'll "tranfer" the profits, or divide them, on a route such as PHX - OAK and "even out" their overall profits.

RJ's do make perfect sense to many destinations with smaller yields and pax loads. They do have their place.

Scotty G

[daveflyshi]

Oh Scotty, thank you for not making me start things. I really hate that part of the argument. The old RSM, ASM argument will live on forever. YES, regional jets to have a place in the market. Should they be doing all the work? NO. That was the point I was trying to make. Yes the 73, or A31 series have their place, and the point I was trying to make was that the right size plane should be used for the right size market. I do not pretend to know how many souls in back to break even in your plane, but my guess is that my plane could break even in the markets yours could not. That means of course, your planes should be going to the markets which make it profitable, and mine should be going to the ones yours will not.

Now, just to be sure that you and I are on the same wave length...

I agree with your frustrations with what seems like inexperienced people flying the routes which can sustain your airplane, but which management is taking for "lower cost" employees. If your management (and I do not know) is not playing "fairly" then I can totally empathize with you. But, I will defend my decision to stay at "A Regional Airline" to the end of the earth. I am happy to be in a job now. More than that, I am happy to be flying one of the most advanced airplanes in the industry. I am at a career airline, and that we fly "little jets" is not an issue.

I know this seems like a trivial argument. I will not degrade any pilot in our industry, and really am ashamed that our union, and companies love to play it as a game. An airline pilot is an airline pilot. What makes sense is sending the right size airplane to the right size market to insure that we have jobs in the long run. The fact that I get paid to fly airplanes for a living is wonderful. Everyone should go and get on an airplane and go somewhere. That would help us to make the future of air travel even better.

dave hackett

[Scotty G]

Dave,

What's a A31? You mean an Airbus? I assume so. Anyway... Don't get me wrong; Comair *is* an airline you can stay at and make a decent living. No qualms about that. I respect what you guys did with your strike, and you've earned every dollar you negotiated. I payed my strike assesment for you guys.

As for your statement about you'll never degrade another pilot... I sure will. I'll degrade a certain kind of pilot that we know as a SCAB. Let's not even go there right now. I'm quite passionate about that subject - as are others - and have seen the effects first hand. Right now, the pilots at Freedom Airlines are SCABS. They are a non-union airline taking jobs away from other pilots. This agrees with your point about being ashamed of management playing A against B. It's not nice.

"What seems like inexperienced people...," you stated. Not seems. They are. You and I both know that a 500 hour wonder in the right seat of a jet at 390 can cause plenty of trouble.

Scenario - Captain takes off to the back to use the lav. FO accepts a climb to 390 at a heavy weight, and manipulates the autopilot to begin a climb to 390. Except he uses a selected speed. As the jet climbs, the buffet margin narrows and he doesn't pay attention to the speed; it's selected too low.

"Stall.... Stall..."

I've seen it. It's scary. It's just one illustration, though. I know we all have to get our experience some way, and today's industry is changing. But it should not be at the expense of the passengers. It's just a fact that pilots at regionals have lower experience levels. Generally, this is not too much of a problem. But you have to admit a 500 hour wonder in the right seat of a regional jet isn't the same as a 10,000 FO on an Airbus.

On the same note, there are some consumately qualified pilots in the regionals and I respect their professionalism and dedication.

We're on the same wavelength... Trust me! Take care and fly safe!

Scotty G

[daveflyshi]

SOLD

Yes sir, I think we have a winner!

I agree with almost everything you have said. I only have one real question about the Freedom hirees. With all the qualified pilots out on the streets, why would they not be getting the jobs? Are they refusing the jobs for pay reasons?

Only had 3 Scabs during our strike. One has made it back to the line, and is not being very warmly recieved. I don't think I could muster the patience to sit next to him. When I said that I would not degrade any pilots, I certainly was leaving scabs out of the picture. I agree with your assessment of them.

Speaking of assessments, thanks for paying yours. We were sure that the company would either back down before they locked us out of our planes, or that it would not last 90 days. We got back to work on the 89th day. You guys helped out big time, and we certainly appreciate it.

See ya up there

dave hackett

[Scotty G]

Re: SOLD

Dave,

You're more than welcome. That's (one thing) ALPA is for!

I'm positive Freedom's hiring protocol involves current Mesa pilots (proven) and new-hires from the Farmington "academy."

Poor kids have zero idea what they have just done to their careers. And we (ALPA and the AWA and Mesa MEC's) told them so face to face.

Scotty G

[Pick]

Hmmmm......there are a few more things that the airlines have to deal with. If your chosen airline flies in a limited number of cities, it is relatively easy to arrange the schedule for NXXXX to arrive at a maintenance base capable of doing the next scheduled maintenance without virtually deadheading or making it a ferry flight.

The more "narrowed" that your fleet is, the easier that gets.......one airframe, one engine type......it is almost heaven from a scheduling point of view. It is too bad that we have to throw in '27, '37, '47, '57, '67, trip7, and then add the various versions of the MD series to further compound things. Heaven forbid that we have to add those metric things from across the pond!

Do we even HAVE a taildock that airplane will fit in?!

What if our airline has a "maintenance holiday" with their new jets? (AirTran 717's come to mind)....exactly who is going to "fix" them when the time comes? Can they afford to pay that cost on the revenue generated by the current fares? Heavy maintenance throws such a kink in the budget, doesn't it? and on SO many levels! We make money on new jets then collapse when we have to maintain them?!?!?! Bankruptcy lawyers must be foaming at the mouth in anticipation!

It makes my head hurt just trying to figure out who is playing whom in this game. You have "players" like Boeing, Airbus, Pratt, Rolls, CFM, GE, Bombardier, Sunstrand, Hamilton Standard, etc......not to mention the outside suppliers that supply the "major" players......what do you think they ought to fix FIRST?

Maintenance labor costs have to be tough........labor costs have to be tough all the way around.......but how much of that labor cost is actually caused by outside influences? I can't get a print and the overhaul manual doesn't cover this?.......It will require approval by engineering.....Please hold, that engineer isn't available at the moment.......(God forbid if he retired!)

The crew sees one thing, the maintenance staff sees another, the public sees yet another.......and the media is looking for a cover story....

And you thought the answer was going to be simple?

[tow-3]

my view from the right seat

my view from the right seat at eagle is not that the system is broke, the problem is that the management is broke. at AMR don carty has no idea what he is doing. he says that we must compete with southwest, so lets look at that.

southwest pilots make almost as much as AA pilots, IE 737 V 737. the rampers at southwest make the same, so do the ticket agents. so where is the problem? southwest has 36 labor employees to every manager, AMR has 6. there is the problem. managment does not produce revenue, labor does. they need to stop micro-managing the company and get rid of half of management.

AMR is running almost 85 percent load factors, much as the other airlines. they could all raise prices a bit and not loose loadfactor, and turn a profit.

the whole thing is through mismanagment, and good PR they see this as a way to turn back the labor agreements 30 years.

AMR would love to fly with labor rates like they are at eagle. who wouldnt what to run a compay that pays it pilots less than the golden arches pays.