Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

[SkyvanDelta]

May be interesting to some of you.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=909_1227653317

[CMW]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Great landing - did he kill the engines in an attempt to keep from damaging the props or is it standard procedure for that aircraft to deadstick in a nosewheel lock failure etc? Looked like he did everything he could to keep from hitting the nose/props. Very interesting to watch. Any comment from a real pilot with an explanation would be interesting.

[GRNDP51]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Yeah he did a great job with those props. Good job all over

[Inverted]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Great landing - did he kill the engines in an attempt to keep from damaging the props or is it standard procedure for that aircraft to deadstick in a nosewheel lock failure etc? Looked like he did everything he could to keep from hitting the nose/props. Very interesting to watch. Any comment from a real pilot with an explanation would be interesting.

Great Pilot skills and landing.

Its not standard procedure to kill the engines, but if I were to do that in my plane I sure as hell would do it if I had the time and could manage it safely. Remember Pilot and passengers come first. He did it to save both the props and the engines. If you prop strike with the engines running they will require a teardown. Worst case scenario he will have a couple blades to replace, some nose work and fix the failed component in the nose gear, which looks like the downlock mechanism.

[WASP-kid]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Wow! Very well done indeed.

[W J Pearce]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

If you prop strike with the engines running they will require a teardown.

What is the real FAA rule on this? I have heard conflicting info. Does any strike require a tear down or just a strike that results in the engine stopping?

BTW, Very well done by the PIC!


Thanks,

[King]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

What is the real FAA rule on this? I have heard conflicting info. Does any strike require a tear down or just a strike that results in the engine stopping?

BTW, Very well done by the PIC!


Thanks,

Its not an FAA requirement, it's the engine manufacturers that require the engine teardown and inspection.

Sadly, this airplane will require a complete teardown of BOTH engines as both props struck the ground.

They do not have to be turning to require the teardown and inspection.

[Inverted]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Yes its specific to engine manufacturer, but even they can only require it via AD or service bulletin, otherwise its a recommendation. For instance when Kirby Chambliss struck his edge 540 , The AEIO-540 requires a full crank inspection if the engine is stopped during the prop strike. He just threw another prop on it and away he flew.

The only FAR's I have found call for strong recommendation of engine teardowns for inspection but they dont require it yet. Insurance is also something to think about. My insurance requires me to have a teardown inspection on any aircraft covered on my policy. Depending on the planes engine is whether or not I agree with that policy. Some engines are more prone to crankcase and crankshaft failure than others.

[Inverted]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Its not an FAA requirement, it's the engine manufacturers that require the engine teardown and inspection.

Sadly, this airplane will require a complete teardown of BOTH engines as both props struck the ground.

They do not have to be turning to require the teardown and inspection.

Actually there is a clause that calls for the mechanic's final recommendation as to whether the engine needs a teardown or not. So given the video footage as evidence he might be able to convince the A&P to sign him off...

[King]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Actually there is a clause that calls for the mechanic's final recommendation as to whether the engine needs a teardown or not. So given the video footage as evidence he might be able to convince the A&P to sign him off...

Except in todays litigation happy world, no mechanic in his right mind will go against a engine manufacturers Service Letter/Bulletin to have the engine torn down and inspected.

In our shop a couple of years ago, we had a Cessna 210 that the nose gear collapsed foward (in our hangar) and put two very slight dings on two of the prop blades. The dings could have easily been dressed out and we could have run out the crank and said see ya.

The engine manufacturers SB specifically says that the engine MUST be torn down for inspection regardless if the engine is running or not. If the prop touches the ground, the engine comes apart.....no if and or buts about it.

[Inverted]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Dont get me wrong I think thats how it should be. Touch the prop on the ground with the engine stopped, you could easily jar the crank an crack a journal, or crack the case. Its very easy to do. Better to be safe than sorry.

Another dynamic is prop striking an engine running and the engine doesnt quit. We had a Citabria strike a prop on takeoff. Pilot didnt even know it, started the climb out and the plane just wouldnt climb. Did a 180 and landed without problems. Come to find out the props were bent back a couple inches. There was an applicable inspection for this type of strike. If I can remember it involved a compression test and a boroscope and thats it. The plane is flying great I fly her all the time.

[W J Pearce]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

King and Inverted,

Thank you much for shedding light on this subject for me. I have known some to strike and not have a tear down while others did. Never really understood the the difference.

[King]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Dont get me wrong I think thats how it should be. Touch the prop on the ground with the engine stopped, you could easily jar the crank an crack a journal, or crack the case. Its very easy to do. Better to be safe than sorry.

Another dynamic is prop striking an engine running and the engine doesnt quit. We had a Citabria strike a prop on takeoff. Pilot didnt even know it, started the climb out and the plane just wouldnt climb. Did a 180 and landed without problems. Come to find out the props were bent back a couple inches. There was an applicable inspection for this type of strike. If I can remember it involved a compression test and a boroscope and thats it. The plane is flying great I fly her all the time.

If you own a certificated airplane with a Teledyne engine in it and you have any type of prop strike (running or not), it needs to be removed and torn-down. Teledyne has a Service Letter issued that states that fact. If the FAA were asked what should be done, they would never overrule the engine manufacturer. In fact I have discussed this issue with thier field techs and they say that if the prop was wood, they would rule that the engine must be torn down.

Do I think a wood prop strike warrants a tear down.......no........and I probably would not tear it down if it was mine, same can be said for a non-running engine prop strike if it was mine. Now if the airplane was in my shop for the same reason, I would go with the Service Letter, because if anything happened down the road with that airplane I would be held liable as the engine manufacturer left nothing to the imagination.

[King]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Here is the TCM SB:

http://www.121five.com/admin/FeatureArticles/TCM-Prop%20Strikes%20and%20Hydraulic%20Lock.pdf

[King]

Re: Emergency Landing. Collapsing nose gear on small plane video link.

Lycoming's Service Bulletin:

http://www.lycoming.textron.com/support/publications/service-bulletins/pdfs/SB533A.pdf

It is sad the way things have turned out over the years due to lawsuits........but any A&P would put his ticket and bank account in jeopardy if he returned to service almost any prop strike.

A repair station would never return to service an airplane with a prop strike.........unless they are willing to loose thier hard earned certificate.