Gold Cancelled to winds

[AirDOGGe]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

Foresight is a wonderful thing.



It's quite rare for the winds to get that bad during race week, and I've seen some pretty windy days up there.


I'm sure the RARA was trying to get the LIGHTER aircraft races complete in the earlier part of the day as usual, assuming that the heavier aircraft (T-6s and unlimiteds) could handle the stronger winds that always materialize in the afternoons at Stead in September.

Despite forecasts, I don't think anyone expected the winds to get as bad as they did. Who could have had the foresight to expect that?

[planecrazy2]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

I was there, I am a pilot, it was the correct decision.

Told my son who is 13, and just devastated there was no showdown, that it was the right decision, but it does not ease the disappointment.

I think it says much about the character of the vast majority of AAFO members here that most all of you agree it was the prudent thing to do.

I am proud to be a member of AAFO right now. (Sorry I missed the BBQ)

Just wait till next year……



Glen

[dvddude]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

I just want to add my two cents in regards to RARA for cancelling the final Unlimited Gold race on Sunday. If you were not there, you have NO idea how bad the conditions were that day. I was in the General Admission grandstands and saw the Thunder Mustang crash right before the Unlimited Gold.

During this time, the wind was so strong that it blew off my sunglasses and they flew about 6 rows down the stands. After my hat blew off the first time and nearly ended up on the ramp below, I quit wearing it. During the 30 minute "recess" for the pilots' meeting, I went to visit my old friend, the "sani-hut". While I was walking to the hut, those 40 knot gusts during that time were so strong that my eyes kept getting sand-blasted and it was hard to keep them open.

I am a pilot with lots of experience, and I had an extremely uneasy feeling about watching the upcoming Unlimited Gold races. Something in the pit of my stomach was telling me that this was going to be a very ugly race because of the conditions. So, we had one airplane totalled, a near direct 35 to 40 knot crosswind, very limited runway options for an emergency landing, and it was the first time in my nearly 2 decades of attending Reno that I seriously considered leaving early because I thought I was going to see another catastrophe in the Gold race. In addition to this, the sun was going down fast and there was massive amounts of blowing dust on the race course from time to time. The visibility issue alone from the dust and/or the shadows of the declining sun could have been enough to cancel, IMO. Those conditions overall were absolutely atrocious and I would not have flown in them for any reason.

I would like to give HUGE kudos and a thanks to RARA and the pilots in deciding to not fly the final race. I thought that was an excellent decision and the right thing to do. I have lots of respect for RARA and it's pilots and to me, this action just exemplifies the professional attitude and consideration that "safety is first". That is exactly the way it should be. RARA owes us NOTHING - not even a refund, like some have mentioned earlier. I think they should be commended for making the correct decision.

Remember, safety trumps EVERYTHING!

Thank you RARA and the Unlimited pilots for not continuing on. All of you have my deepest respect for doing the right thing and not flying.

Am I disappointed - sure, but I would have been a lot more upset if I had to watch another airplane crash that day.

My 2 cents.

[gp70442]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

Everyone (except one) appears to have forgotten that the T-6 Gold was also called BY THE PILOTS. It only got worse after that.

These guys are all racers and wanted to race. It was bad out there folks!

GP

[ignomini]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

I've read enough NTSB reports about fatalities because somebody "had to fly now." what would happen if Steven Hinton or Rod Lewis were killed trying to man up and tough it out with the long term vets. I hated the cancellation, but if the pilots don't feel comfortable there's nothing more to discuss.

Yes it sucks that the Ghost didn't get her shot, but better alive to race next year than be champion with a trail of dead pilots behind you. The Thunder Mustang crash had to have been affected by winds. Any reasonable person would consider the risks before choosing to fly after that.

[Curt]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

I was on top of the Warlock Race Trailer and it was very spooky up there

[supercub]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

dvddude..........I had the same gut feeling, and like you, something bad was going to happen and considered leaving early too. Remember what Kent Piesch (sorry if I misspelled your name) said, that it was moderate to severe out there......and very squirelly with the wind coming up and over and around the hangars and grandstands. I've never met the gentleman, but I respect him as a pilot, so I gave what he said a lot of weight. It boils down to, They made the right decision.
Brian

[BKB]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

I think what has been lost (especially with the last few posts) is RARA didn't make the call THE PILOTS DID!
The wind had been forecast.I stayed at the feild Saturday night. Yes I woke up when Voodoo was doing their run up at 4:00am.
I got up to listen and was surprised by the wind at that hour.
Knowing how weather goes...................knowing too, it was only going to get worse. I'd be willing to bet good money that 80-90% of the folks go to Reno to see the big iron run(I know I do).This is what Reno owes us the paying race fans.Yes it has to be safe too.The point here is we all are going to have differing opinions.I don't disagree with the fact that the decision to stand down was made(lucky for me I'm not one of those throttle jockeys).
What I find disheartening is the simple fact that it could have not been done had the program been shifted around.
As to the T-6 Gold race being cancelled by the pilots.I never heard one mention of this.Again maybe I was napping during one of those numerous long time wasting breaks.

Brian (B2)

[chiefnerd]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

I was there and here is my take:

As others have already said, safety is the primary concern and the winds had already contributed to George Gibbony's accident during a mayday landing during the super sport race.

I had a chance to speak with John Penney very briefly after the decision was made to cancel and his statement was that "safety is the #1 concern". I could tell that he *really* wanted to fly the Gold race but that this was the logical decision. I feel much worse for him and his fellow pilots and crew than for those of us in the crowd as they prepared all year for this event. Just remember that we can always buy tickets for next year, but those pilots and aircraft are irreplaceable.

It looks like the 2011 season will be exciting with the return of Galloping Ghost and several R4360 competitors!

[greyphantom]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

Oh chiefnerd... or shall i say Justin... i completely agree with your take. My only complaint is how many beers will be sacrificed for the next year arguing with you about who would have won between Strega and The Ghost.....

I was there and here is my take:

As others have already said, safety is the primary concern and the winds had already contributed to George Gibbony's accident during a mayday landing during the super sport race.

I had a chance to speak with John Penney very briefly after the decision was made to cancel and his statement was that "safety is the #1 concern". I could tell that he *really* wanted to fly the Gold race but that this was the logical decision. I feel much worse for him and his fellow pilots and crew than for those of us in the crowd as they prepared all year for this event. Just remember that we can always buy tickets for next year, but those pilots and aircraft are irreplaceable.

It looks like the 2011 season will be exciting with the return of Galloping Ghost and several R4360 competitors!

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

The additional drama created by the cancellation of the Unlimited and T-6Gold will just make the drama this off season that much more delicious....

Although Stevo showed us that Strega pretty much can do what she wants... We never really got to see what The Galloping Ghost, Voodoo and Rare Bear are capable of...

It was the right decision, the winds were extreme and maydays could have been disastrous..

Super Sport truly was not worth the damage and effort that took place.. we could have had much worse problems had others raced who did not.

I was nearly brought to tears seeing George last night after he showed up at the banquet.. That we lost the chance to see what he could do with his airplane is sad.. that he survived pretty well intact is nothing short of a miracle given the way the airplane disintegrated around him!

Lots of hangar flying going to keep us busy for the year to come!

[C_roundy]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

[QUOTE=AAFO_WSagar;83111]
Although Stevo showed us that Strega pretty much can do what she wants... We never really got to see what The Galloping Ghost, Voodoo and Rare Bear are capable of...QUOTE]

I respectfully disagree sir. Strega did repeatedly prove she was blistering fast for a portion of the elapsed time and distance of the race that would have been the proof this year. Whether she had enough, (much less enough left) when it was scheduled to matter is a question that even Stevo could not possibly answer with certainty.
I almost think I understand what a woman must feel like when she loses a baby. The stars were almost aligned for an historic battle.
But unfortunately we cannot know what might have been.

Would'nt have changed it for the world though, considering the combination of wind speed and direction. Chuck Roundy

[C_roundy]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

Anyone that was not at Stead today would think that this was a bad result, but if you were there you would have understood.

The wind was blowing a steady 30mph gusting to 40 in a direction that would have been a crosswind for either runway. The two tailwheel airplanes that started the Super Sport race did not successfully land the aircraft, and George honestly did not have a safe option for landing his plane dead stick. The crash was very scary to watch and happened not 5 minutes before the Unlimited introductions.

If that wasn't enough, the ONLY people I witnessed discussing whether to fly or not was the PILOTS of the unlimiteds. With a blown engine in one of those airplanes things would have been seriously dangerous. Additionally, if the race did go on it wouldn't have been a real all out Unlimited gold race. The winds and turbulence would have made it unsafe to even fly the course at the speeds these guys are pushing.

As a pilot, I believe they absolutely made the correct decision today. As much as I love the races, I care more about continuing to see my favorite race planes and pilots tear up the sky in the years to come.

Just a slight correction. HAD they gone it would have been a deadly serious all balls out race among the big guns. They all would have run whatever manifold pressures/ADI/Nitrous e.t.c. that their all out strategy, and mid race engine temperatures and oil pressure etc. dictated.

Certainly the perfect race line on every given turn would have been altered drasticly (its never the same twice anyway), but they would have gone big or gone home alot earlier considering the weather forcast, and blood/sweat/tears/money they spent to be ready to outdo their previous team records this year much less beat the competition.

Is anybody besides me gonna admit that the best pylon racers specificly practice for adverse conditions?

Oh yeah, gotta remember to add thats just my opinion...., yep,... I'm probably the only one who believes it!

[Eric Martin]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

With those winds, I would not want to even try to land the Galloping Ghost, the wings are the shortest ever on a mustang and the ailerons look like business cards, that would be a hand full to try to land in that wind. If you were holding back till sunday, well thats your problem. Safety should always come first in this event.

[C_roundy]

Re: Gold Cancelled to winds

With those winds, I would not want to even try to land the Galloping Ghost, the wings are the shortest ever on a mustang and the ailerons look like business cards, that would be a hand full to try to land in that wind. If you were holding back till sunday, well thats your problem. Safety should always come first in this event.

1) We all agree safety comes first in public air racing.
(even when your getting out of the bathtub for that matter)

2) To grossly oversimplify, the higher the wingloading, the more predictably it handles in gusty conditions, I.E. plants when you set it down etc.. (ask a guy who flys both extremes)

3) I believe that Stiletto was cut at exactly the same span station, and therefore the same aileron length as G.G.
(I might be wrong here, someone please correct me if provable.)

But if I'm right we can ask Skip Holms if She lacked aileron authority;
and Jimmy himself for that matter. I seriously doubt that was/is a major concern with either airplane compared to achieving competancy on crosswind landing rudder technique as with any short coupled, steep sitting tail dragger.