Course dimensions and shape. Would smaller/larger, rounder,squarer, be better/worse?

[SkyvanDelta]

Anyone want to comment on what they think or know what the fastest/best course would be for the different classes, working with the land available now, or ideal shape of a course if you could arrange an arbitrary course. Is the current course too small, too big, too circular, too eliptical, too irregular, just right...?

Here is the link to the current course: http://www.pylonjudge.org/courseinfo.html

Here is the course size and speed approximated from what I've gathered:

1. Biplanes and Fomula class: 3.1 mile course/250mph.
2. T6 class: 5 mile course 230mph.
3. Sport class: 6.4 mile course/380mph.
4. Unlimited, Jet and Super Sport class: 8.5 mile course/500mph.

[spacegrrrl]

Re: Course dimensions and shape. Would smaller/larger, rounder,squarer, be better/wor

The only courses I've heard that have points for improvement are the Unlimited and the Jets (and given how fast they are progressing Super Sport they might have the same problem) I understand there are a couple of pylons that are more "pinched" than the others.

Of couse ideal course to fly is straight line, but not a great spectator experience....

Spacegrrrl

[Guest]

Re: Course dimensions and shape. Would smaller/larger, rounder,squarer, be better/wor

Your numbers are pretty close, Sky. Some minor tweaks but in general, a good representation.

IMO;

Since Super Sports are now on the Unlimited Course, they've been spared what is generally regarded as two of the more difficult pylons to pick up and round...Sport 4 to Sport 5. These two turns represent two of the tightest turns on the entire circuit. From Sport 3 to round Sport 4 requires a 57 degree turn radius...from Sport 5 to Sport 6 is 59 degrees. There are a couple others...Middle 3 is a 60+degree turn for the T-6's for example. Given the approx 100mph difference between Sport and T-6's, it's quite possibly the most difficult part of any course, in that respect.

In the early day of having all the Sports rounding the Unlimited Course for Lap One then transitioning to the Sport course, we used to bet on how many Sports would cut Outer 6. It got so bad for a while that we'd position two judges WAY inside the course to pick up the "Split Gaggle" (once one guy heads inside the course, temptation takes over and others play "Follow the Leader"). Many times we’d be looking at the underside of the Sport class going by…700ft or more INSIDE the course.

Bottom line: outer pylons seem to be the most difficult to pick up and tightest to round as they represent the area of greatest change in attitude. Sure our pilot members can expand on this with much more detail and from a much more knowledgeable perspective. Just the observation of a judge who's been on every pylon on the course.

Interesting thought though, Sky. Know the changes made circa 2001 had an impact and that RARA continues to look at the course for enhancements, deadlines notwithstanding...

Cheers,

[Mluvara]

Re: Course dimensions and shape. Would smaller/larger, rounder,squarer, be better/wor

For visualization, here's a graphic representation of G's on the course from September Fury in 2007. Certainly, as speed goes up, G's go up to stay on the same course. Until the sport racers break the 450mph mark, this should not be an issue on the unlimited course.

Green = 1-2 g's
Yellow = 2-3 g's
Red = >3 g's

Michael

[Big_Jim]

Re: Course dimensions and shape. Would smaller/larger, rounder,squarer, be better/wor

The 'optimum' Unlimited course was at Mojave...a front stretch, back stretch, and two relatively wide, three-pylon turns. It was just under 9 miles, I think. And more important, all the terrain was flat...something of a double-edged sword...nothing to hit, but very hard to use landmarks to find the racecourse. At Reno, you just follow the terrain to dictate the course direction.

Of course, I'm still kind of snickering about cancelling the Gold race and all the uproar over the winds this year. I UNDERSTAND WHY, AND I AGREE....however, Sunday afternoon was 'just an average day' at Mojave.

[laminar]

Re: Course dimensions and shape. Would smaller/larger, rounder,squarer, be better/wor

Since they added the 58 bypass on the east side of Mojave it makes it really tough to fit an unlimited course in there without shutting down a major California freeway.

However, I have been spending alot of time recently flying over the old George air force base, and I tell you its hard to come up with reasons why it wouldn't be an awesome site for a california race.

Elliot Seguin
Race 68

[Big_Jim]

Re: Course dimensions and shape. Would smaller/larger, rounder,squarer, be better/wor

Since they added the 58 bypass on the east side of Mojave it makes it really tough to fit an unlimited course in there without shutting down a major California freeway.

However, I have been spending alot of time recently flying over the old George air force base, and I tell you its hard to come up with reasons why it wouldn't be an awesome site for a california race.

Elliot Seguin
Race 68

Yes, as I made comment in the other thread about the 1000 mile races:

"I've always thought the former George AFB in Victorville, CA would be a great place for a race, but...."

[SkyvanDelta]

Re: Course dimensions and shape. Would smaller/larger, rounder,squarer, be better/wor

Would it be a good/bad idea to have the racers run the course and then do some type of aerobatic movement like a roll or loop or would that just destroy the fast course scenario?

Or perhaps a figure 8 where they have to turn left and then right...?