NTSB update in Reno

[Bob]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

I think the recommendations are primarily referring to "highly modified" aircraft which would encompass the Gold and some of the Silver racers. So, if you have to provide an engineering validation for mods, the days of the last minute thrash are likely over.

Nah, you will just get a crew of people walking around wearing hats that say "Inganeers R Us" There will have to be something in place to allow for the last minute stuff. lol

Actually I have seen people from other crews and people in crews that inspect everything many times over, then its tested, inspected again and given a green light. What I think the officials will take a closer look at is modifications done prior to race week, ie: big stuff.
We shal see, PRS isnt that far away, and that will be the test bed for changes imo.

[xmh53wrench]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

Personally....I just want to know EXACTLY what this means....

"Therefore the National Transportation Safety Board makes the following
recommendations to...."

[Bob]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

I think it means that the NTSB can only make a recomdation, the FAA decides makes the rules/laws

[xmh53wrench]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

I think it means that the NTSB can only make a recomdation, the FAA decides makes the rules/laws

Ah, thanks.

[TwoZeroWest]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

I think it means that the NTSB can only make a recomdation, the FAA decides makes the rules/laws

Spot on. That is EXACTLY how it works. That's why the 737 rudder problem took so long to fix, and why airline pilot rest rules have only in the past three months been changed. Some NTSB recommendations are implemented rapidly (CRM is the most far-reaching example of this), while others take years or simply die on the vine.

There is only so much pressure that the NTSB can exert - they have no regulatory authority whatsoever but the chair is a Presidential appointment. Lots of power there.

The ball was officially hit into the other half of the court today folks. The FAA will be the final arbiter of 'what is' in the 2012 air racing season. We need to pay careful attention to what they say from here on out.

TZW

[Wilnit]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

NTSB makes recommendations, FAA makes rules, I thought it was a good press conference....... Made my day a bit better!

[Skymonster]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

Will be interesting to hear the FAAs and RARAs responses. Whilst the FAA may have the final say, I can't see any of the NTSB recommendations being passed over - if they were, and another accident was to happen...

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

Don't have time right now to go back and listen to the video again but I'd swear, twice, she said "Our investigation revealed that this pilot, in this airplane, had never flown at this speed, on this course, in this airplane"

Then I read in the two publications linked above, both, including the story on the actual NTSB site page have that quote as "Our investigation revealed that this pilot, in this airplane, had never flown at this speed, on this course".. The ommission of those last three words change the meaning of the entire sentence in my mind...??

See you in June!

[bill_f]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

Don't have time right now to go back and listen to the video again but I'd swear, twice, she said "Our investigation revealed that this pilot, in this airplane, had never flown at this speed, on this course, in this airplane"

In a later version of yesterday's RGJ article, Mike Houghton also challenged that:
"Houghton also said he questioned the NTSB’s statement that Leeward had never flown his aircraft at top speed on that course. He said Leeward likely went faster during the qualifying rounds, when the course was wide open."

Same link with updated content: http://www.rgj.com/article/20120410/...text|FRONTPAGE

[supercub]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

I haven't heard the complete report, but I did like the statement at the beginning saying something to the fact, "That we are not here to shut down the air races" I thought that was a very positive statement.
Brian

[Pete]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

Don't have time right now to go back and listen to the video again but I'd swear, twice, she said "Our investigation revealed that this pilot, in this airplane, had never flown at this speed, on this course, in this airplane"

Then I read in the two publications linked above, both, including the story on the actual NTSB site page have that quote as "Our investigation revealed that this pilot, in this airplane, had never flown at this speed, on this course".. The ommission of those last three words change the meaning of the entire sentence in my mind...??

See you in June!

That's what the press DOES, Wayne. They twist words for dramatic effect. Good reporting doesn't sell. Drama and controversy sell. (and sex too, but it was too hard to fold into this story... details at 11.)

I think the next real piece of news we get is from the panel Mike Houhgton appointed.

[Leo]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

Dunno.
Seemed a pretty light "sentence" to me. Better tech inspection follow up makes sense. G training may not make much difference, and G suits were to be studied and the feasability and effect evaluated before implementation.
I don't know how much smoother you could make turn 8 and reversing direction just moves the issue to turn 1 which looks tighter and I feel points you at the crowd during a more critical part of the turn.
Reading the report it mentions short screws on the trim tab, insufficient oversite of any remedy to it and the possibility that the mods to the airframe had a part. Legally it sounds like they kinda threw Mr. Leeward, crew and RARA under the bus.
Face it, whatever the ultimate cause, WHERE it landed was a freak. Like lightning striking there are a thousand scientific reasons and variables that makes it THAT spot and almost impossible to predict.
It will be interesting to see what the FAA and insurance companies comes up with for new requirements and rules.

[flyingjibus]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

I think that the most important thing to me that I have learned from this is that I am going to have a really hard time watching them come around pylon 8 in September.

We probobly all are, but I dont think I am really admitting to myself how hard its going to be.

I need to be there, I need to watch a sunday gold, I need to see all the planes that take off for the race land safely after the checkered flag. I know that this has to happen for my healing to be complete, but I dont think I am going to "Enjoy" it.

I guess it took this breifing to happen, for me to know that the races are going to happen, to really think about being there again.

its going to be rough.

[ignomini]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

Dunno.
Seemed a pretty light "sentence" to me. Better tech inspection follow up makes sense. G training may not make much difference, and G suits were to be studied and the feasability and effect evaluated before implementation.
I don't know how much smoother you could make turn 8 and reversing direction just moves the issue to turn 1 which looks tighter and I feel points you at the crowd during a more critical part of the turn.
Reading the report it mentions short screws on the trim tab, insufficient oversite of any remedy to it and the possibility that the mods to the airframe had a part. Legally it sounds like they kinda threw Mr. Leeward, crew and RARA under the bus.
Face it, whatever the ultimate cause, WHERE it landed was a freak. Like lightning striking there are a thousand scientific reasons and variables that makes it THAT spot and almost impossible to predict.
It will be interesting to see what the FAA and insurance companies comes up with for new requirements and rules.

Spot on Sir. What is involved in adding G suits to an airplane's systems? If the suit is not self contained, a requirement for them could push a lot (most?) of the participants out of the sport.

Ever since the Rose incident, I always worry when an airplane wobbles on course, but as far as watching the Unlimiteds come around turn 8 in angry mode, it's been a couple years since we've had a Sunday Gold. I can't wait.

[MMPerk]

Re: NTSB update in Reno

I attended the press conference and got to meet the director of the NTSB. I thought it was clear that the extra testing and engineering information was going to be required on 'highly modified' aircraft only.

By the way, where is the dead line on the front stretch? I thought it was the north side of runway...