Shake up in the works?

[knot4u]

Re: Shake up in the works?

I wish Greg Shaw would come back. I'd work for him.

We have done so much with so little we can now do anything with nothing.

Good times.

[BuckyD]

Re: Shake up in the works?

Even though I count myself amongst the ranks of air racing fans who favor the Big Iron UNL Class, I can appreciate where Philip is comin' from. I too find it disappointing that ALL the other racing classes don't get more coverage attention than they do (& which they genuinely-deserve). Without a doubt, these classes DO enjoy a dedicated fan support base & I really love watching (& photographing) each & every one of them. I think w/them all on the schedule, it builds a crescendo that sets-up the excitement stage for all the Unlimited events.

All I can say to f1-69, fm my own personal perspective, is not to get too worked-up about what stuff gets posted & what doesn't, on these online fan discussion boards. The majority of air race people & 'just-curious folks' who visit & read the daily dialogue- don't post EVER. Each racing class IS viable within the air racing community & they each add some individual color & variety to our exciting special motorsport. This is a super-critical time regarding this sport's very future & air racing people on all levels, really-need to stand united in promoting ourselves w/positive optimism & enthusiasm. Now THAT's something that would be great to see~ 'Go-Viral'.

DBD

[John H]

Re: Shake up in the works?

It's too bad F1 class is at 8 am . Instead of 2pm .. I am not ever getting there that early.

[ShermB]

Re: Shake up in the works?

The IF-1 race early before it is too hot and the winds come up. Much easier (and safer) for you to get up early instead of endangering the planes/pilots.

If you weren't there recently when the Sunday Gold races were cancelled due to winds, you weren't aware that the "little guys" raced and damned well. Much better show of racing and tactical skills.

[stuntflyr]

Re: Shake up in the works?

I think that everyone appreciates the other classes for what they are, and my opinion is that ALL of the classes are required to have a successful event--as witnessed by the several attempts over the years to have F-1, Biplane, T-6 races at various venues that may have produced some decent racing but drew little to no spectator support. And even the Unlimited-only events that have been tried, none have lasted more than two tries. I also think that any aviation junkie is going to 'appreciate' all the things you cited, but unless you are an owner/pilot/crew the attachment you have to any of the (sorry for putting it this way....) "support classes" just aren't going to have the passion or the draw to the average-joe spectator that walks through the door. That is NO DIG AT YOU AND THE CONTRIBUTION YOU HAVE MADE BY RACING. It is very much appreciated. And trust me...I can remember one year when the only two classes that raced were the Unlimiteds and a 'depleted' F-1 class. It was much more airshow that year than air race...and only then did a lot of people start appreciating the 'little guys' more. It always has been the Unlimiteds, it always will be the Unlimiteds, and even though the Sport Class has been trying to jockey itself to 'take over' once the Unlimiteds become extinct....once the Unlimiteds go, so does the large portion of the fan base that shows up. It's not *****ing on the other classes...it's just a bottom-line reality. But the REAL bottom-line here is that at least there IS passion for the sport. Even if it's just directed at one of the show ponies, at least there is still that passion. When that disappears, I don't care what class is your favorite...the final nail is in the casket of the sport.

That is all probably true in the modern Reno Air Race era. I wonder how many people even know that the Formula 1 racer's core group maintained the existence of pylon racing from 1950 to 1963 by flying air shows large and small around the country. Mainly the big shows in the east and midwest and the open space of Southern California provided the venues.
Too bad they insist on running the races for these classes so early. I recall these races running in the late morning in the 70's and 80's. Then the Unlimiteds number started to increase so more races could be run and so...
Chris...

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: Shake up in the works?

Too bad they insist on running the races for these classes so early. I recall these races running in the late morning in the 70's and 80's. Then the Unlimiteds number started to increase so more races could be run and so...

Thought I remembered them running later in the day, at least on Sunday.. I'm not a "morning person" so "back in the day" I'd usually get out there a bit later in the day.. and still saw that amazing racehorse start!

There is no question that the "little guys" are exciting as all get out but, I do think the early AM starts is a big part of the lack of following... Understanding, of course, how windy it gets out there as the ground in the great basin heats up....

[AAFO_WSagar]

Re: Shake up in the works?

PS... this topic might deserve to be in a separate thread... ya think? Ask and ye shall receive..

[Big_Jim]

Re: Shake up in the works?

Thought I remembered them running later in the day, at least on Sunday.. I'm not a "morning person" so "back in the day" I'd usually get out there a bit later in the day.. and still saw that amazing racehorse start!

There is no question that the "little guys" are exciting as all get out but, I do think the early AM starts is a big part of the lack of following... Understanding, of course, how windy it gets out there as the ground in the great basin heats up....

You're correct, Wayne. Even up into the '90's they ran the F-1 Championship race at around 2:30-3:00 in the afternoon, right before the T-6 Championship. But that was when there were four classes racing...and between the Jets and the Sports, now you have an extra 5-6 races on the schedule each day. The little guys get pushed earlier and earlier into the morning to accomodate.

It IS a good thing, given the wind situation, but to me (and this is just purely a personal opinion) the F-1's and the Bipes lost some of the luster when they implemented the staggered start on the runway for safety reasons. I liked the line-abreast race-horse start on the runway and ramp, and even though it was a bit chaotic and dangerous, I liked the scatter pylon so that they could launch on the 'other' runways--not just on 08.

[Dialtapper]

Re: Shake up in the works?

Anyone that could say such a dismissive thing about F-1 shows a total ignorance of what air racing is all about. I've been told repeatedly by unlimited participants that if you want to see real innovation you go to the F-1 and biplane hangar (and these days super sport).

Finally only this forum could produce such a ridiculous thread. The owner of bear gave the team resources and time to produce results. They failed. He has EVERY right to make a big change to get the results he expected when he bought this plane. We don't know the details but I support whatever he decides to do with his plane.

So folks that think you have a say about what happens to Bear, get over it! You are owed nothing no matter how fantastic a fan you claim to be. If you don't like that, buy a racer of your own, then you can run your program with whoever you want, however you want.

Spacegrrrl <- who understands and supports EXACTLY what F1-69 was saying!

"Anyone that could say such a dismissive thing about F-1 shows a total ignorance of what air racing is all about."

Wow Spacegrrrl, strong words. Been called a lot of things, but never ignorant about Air Racing. You sure put me in my place.

"I've been told repeatedly by unlimited participants that if you want to see real innovation you go to the F-1 and biplane hangar (and these days super sport)."

So in your opinion, Unlimited participants have the highest credibility? Not sure I agree with your opinion, but I like the way you think.

For what it's worth, and it's really not worth that much, I started out in biplanes in the early 80's. First as crew, then on to Crew Chief/Owner/Alternate Pilot. Even won the Gold. Years later Crew/Crew Chief on Unlimiteds. So what you're calling my "total ignorance of what air racing is all about" is based on those experiences. Perhaps you have more personal and diverse experience than I do.

My stating the support classes are just that, support classes, was in no way diminishing them, just stating reality. I can tell you this much, when I was with biplanes, and even T-6's, when the Unlimiteds raced, we all dropped what we were doing and watched.

Sorry, but I just find 3350's far more of a challenge than 0-360's, and making a plane go over 500 more satisfying than 200.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

[BUD_XXX]

Re: Shake up in the works?

Seems like we are getting a little bit off track!

[ChrisMX105]

Re: Shake up in the works?

Personally, I am excited by the prospect of something happening with the bear crew that could possibly see the plane worked on and flown more then 3 weeks a year.

I am of the opinion that the bear needs more personal attention and passion to reach that 500+ mark on a consistent basis. I love what Rod has done for the sport and classic aviation in general, but its very easy to see that Rare Bear is not "his baby"

I realize this doesn't appear to be a change in ownership,but it is a change. (again)

Full time Crew Chief, 2 Full time Mechanics, And I personally gaurantee that the airplane got worked on by the volunteer crew and flown a heckuva lot more than 3 weeks a year.

[BuckyD]

Re: Shake up in the works?

A photo to help get- 'back on-track' ~

The Bear Pit on Gold Sunday-9/16/12-7:00-a.m. (-'on the button')...

DBD

[flyingjibus]

Re: Shake up in the works?

Full time Crew Chief, 2 Full time Mechanics, And I personally gaurantee that the airplane got worked on by the volunteer crew and flown a heckuva lot more than 3 weeks a year.

I meant no disrespect to those who have worked so hard on the bear these past years. I have been with you guys the whole time.

Just a comment on the difference between Lyle vs. Rod

[Dago Dog]

Re: Shake up in the works?

Sounds like we need to bring Dago's crew from the Skip years back together again. Nobody beats a Kerch crew in full form!!!